| <gord> o_O | |
| <daviey> Thread Management blows | |
| <dsas> gord: Can't you use gtk with java these days? | |
| <gord> I would guess so, doesn't stop it sucking though | |
| <dsas> just thinking gtk may suck less than swing/awt | |
| <dsas> c# is java syntax but with a somewhat more consistent library and stuff.... | |
| <daviey> you can use c# if you can hit the tab key | |
| <Seeker`_> woo, Enemy at the gates is on | |
| <X3N> good evening James_Pain | |
| <gord> c# is just silly | |
| <daviey> powerful though | |
| <daviey> i benchmarked mono/c#, java, c/c++, python using integer arthritic and c# came second | |
| <Seeker`_> daviey: What came first? | |
| <Seeker`_> and how did you test? | |
| <gord> if Im going to code In a C syntax is going to be plain C not using an interpreter thanks | |
| <daviey> C | |
| *** Seeker`_ is now known as Seeker` | |
| <daviey> mind you; python, having no notion of int was the only one to get the correct answer | |
| <Seeker`> daviey: What test did you run? | |
| <X3N> i guess it depends quite a bit on the compiler though | |
| <gord> did you use python with the psyco module daviey, its not very fast without it | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, it was */+- ints in a while < xxx loop | |
| <Seeker`> how many times did you loop? | |
| <daviey> gord, tried both; didn't make much difference. The problem was it was being too accurate. Didn't restrict to int | |
| <gord> well then you designed a bias benchmark daviey ;) | |
| <daviey> gord, biased because python can | |
| <daviey> 't do interger? | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, the src code is on another machine; but it was billons | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, java was let down by the initialising of the JVM | |
| <gord> sure it can, you made a test that made python change to floats though which if I remember psyco doesn't accelerate very well | |
| <daviey> gord, so it's a floor with python that it can't restrict to int | |
| <gord> its a feature of the language that means you don't need to deal with number types daviey, if you actually want a relatively fair benchmarking test you need to make sure its a test that takes into account the differences between the languages | |
| <gord> either that or just do a thousand benchmarking tests about a thousand things... that seems to be the way that most people deems is the fair way, you can just eliminate blips like that situation with statistics then | |
| <daviey> gord, the scope of my test was to test integer arithmetic. Not to see what was the 'best' language | |
| <dsas> I have enemy at the gate on dvd. good film | |
| <gord> if your gonna refer to a benchmark to indicate the speed of the language its gotta be a solid, fair benchmark daviey ;) | |
| <daviey> dsas, not according to the radio times. 1.6 starts; but i like it | |
| <daviey> gord, i never said it was a test like that. I was purely benchmarking integer arthmetic | |
| <dsas> daviey: I was a fan of the book. the film is no where near as good, but it was still decent. | |
| <dsas> you never see much of the "eastern front". | |
| <dsas> anyway I'm having an early night. g'night folks. | |
| <popey> mooooo | |
| <daviey> baaa | |
| <gord> people don't go moo popey, we go 'hello there' | |
| <popey> me | |
| <gord> and sometimse "ow" | |
| <popey> er | |
| <popey> me | |
| <popey> er | |
| <popey> meh | |
| <popey> thats iut | |
| <popey> gah | |
| <popey> too much belgian beer | |
| <gord> fun you can download the entire linux version of neverwinter nights from biowares website | |
| <daviey> popey, how was FOZDEV? | |
| <popey> FOSDEM was gret | |
| <popey> er | |
| <popey> great | |
| <popey> sorry, too much belgian beer | |
| <daviey> the Z is for the potential Zzzzzz's | |
| <popey> cant type | |
| <Seeker`> lo popey | |
| <popey> time for bed i think | |
| * daviey aint allowed to bed until he does the ironing. She already kicked me out once for not doing it | |
| <daviey> poor me | |
| <gord> why do the simple answers to problems only come after weeks of hacking about with stupid answers... just forcing blender to link to software rendering mesa instead of statically compiling questionable library's makes much more sence | |
| *** jono__ is now known as jono | |
| <bugbot> New on planetuk: Jono Bacon: Lies, lies and more lies <http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=906> | Caroline Ford: step forward <http://secretlondon.livejournal.com/132857.html> | Caroline Ford: Stress <http://secretlondon.livejournal.com/132469.html> | |
| <daviey> Pricey, you really should be in bed by now | |
| <Pricey> daviey, Will be veeeery soon :) | |
| * Pricey smilies at jo no's latest blog entry | |
| <bugbot> New on planetuk: Caroline Ford: a-LARTing <http://secretlondon.livejournal.com/133067.html> | |
| <X3N> she is so buggered | |
| <cablee_46> hello, everybody... | |
| <cablee_46> can anyone help me please... | |
| <gord> you might have better luck in a more active channel, its 4:23am in the uk | |
| <cablee_46> ow... | |
| <cablee_46> i'm sorry... | |
| <gord> no need to be sorry, Im just saying that everyones asleep :) | |
| <cablee_46> ok... | |
| <cablee_46> oh, can i ask you something.. | |
| <gord> you can ask but I wouldn't expect a great answer | |
| <cablee_46> ok, it doesn't matter... | |
| <cablee_46> did you know, where i can request free cds of ubuntu server edition 6.06 LTS? | |
| <cablee_46> i have searching on the site of ubuntu.. | |
| <cablee_46> but there is no option to request that cds... | |
| <X3N> shipit.. | |
| <X3N> nearly bed time | |
| <bugbot> New on planetuk: Caroline Ford: feeling more chirpy <http://secretlondon.livejournal.com/133618.html> | |
| <popey> moo | |
| <GazzaK> baa | |
| <GazzaK> morning popey | |
| <gord> its coooooooooooold and overcast and wet and cold and crap | |
| <Seeker`> mornin | |
| <loudmouthman> hey | |
| <Seeker`> wow, long time no see loudmouthman | |
| <loudmouthman> har har . i was online last week <grin> but yeah . long time .. | |
| <loudmouthman> i love the ubunut live CD its like the Mcguyver of the IT support world. theres nothing I have not been able to use it for! | |
| <GazzaK> can't use it to rescue the princess from the evil overlord | |
| <loudmouthman> Gazzak maybe if we fashioned it like the Glaive from Krull then I could be just like Price Colwyn | |
| <GazzaK> shh | |
| * Seeker` wonders wether any of the 114MB of updates will fix beryl | |
| <GazzaK> loudmouthman, I saw something on the drive in which really upset me | |
| <GazzaK> poor cat | |
| <loudmouthman> huh ? | |
| * popey installed beryl for a laugh on his dell laptop today | |
| * popey notes it crashes gnome-panel | |
| <Seeker`> brb | |
| <popey> my opinion of the stability of beryl remains the same | |
| <loudmouthman> popey must have had a good laugh at that then ! | |
| <loudmouthman> still beryl crashing keeps the ubuntu desktop on a par with incorrectly installed nvidia drivers for directx 9 | |
| <popey> morning jono | |
| <jono> hey | |
| <Seeker`> beryl still doesn't work :( | |
| <GazzaK> Seeker`, awww | |
| <GazzaK> what version? svn? | |
| <Seeker`> no, feisty repo | |
| <mrben> morning all | |
| <popey> welcome back mrben | |
| <popey> how was mozambique? | |
| <popey> (it was mozambique? | |
| <mrben> it was, and it was excellent | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <mrben> tough | |
| <mrben> but worthwhile | |
| <popey> I can imagine | |
| <jayteeuk> Morning all. | |
| <GazzaK> morning jayteeuk & DaveMorris & jono | |
| <DaveMorris> morning | |
| <jayteeuk> Morning GazzaK. | |
| <loudmouthman> okay can I be boring here and ask someone to dig the mx records for ethosmarketing.co.uk and tell me what they see ? | |
| <GazzaK> popey, did you bring me back any chocolate? | |
| <popey> hehe | |
| <GazzaK> well? | |
| <popey> I brought back *some* chocolates, yes | |
| <GazzaK> :'( | |
| <GazzaK> for me, how nice | |
| <jayteeuk> loudmouthman: ethosmarketing.co.uk. 86400 IN MX 20 mxbackup.gradwell.net. | |
| <jayteeuk> And ethosmarketing.co.uk. 86400 IN MX 10 mail.ethosmarketing.co.uk. | |
| <loudmouthman> jaytees cheers. theres supposed to be at least 4 entries in there which i put in on friday. | |
| <AndrewWilliams> same here, | |
| <jono> hey GazzaK | |
| * popey is using povray to render some nice desktop images at 3360x1050 | |
| <popey> its taking a while :) | |
| <DaveMorris> I'm depresed. bloody houses. Can only afford to repay about 135k, and all the proprieties under 190k are sold within a week or 2 | |
| <mrben> DaveMorris: move to Glasgow | |
| <DaveMorris> that will be a long commute | |
| <mrben> you can still get a decent flat for 135k | |
| <AndrewWilliams> I can only get a 70k mortgage, even a tiny terraced goes for 100k here | |
| <popey> http://gallery.popey.com/gallery/FOSDEM2007/Image058 the beer in belgium is great! :) | |
| * loudmouthman and mrs loudmouthman have been seriously considering moving to france house prices and standards of living plus .. well theres less english people. | |
| <mrben> popey: nice! | |
| <mrben> popey: although leffe? not my favourite.... | |
| <mrben> loudmouthman: sadly, most of the people are french.... | |
| * popey had duvel and chimay bleu mostly | |
| <mrben> you should have the golden draak | |
| <loudmouthman> mrben , hehe for me . not a problem <grin> | |
| * jayteeuk is working towards a move to SA. | |
| <popey> http://www.matthewgrove.co.uk/personal/moblog/view/2007-02-23/resized_230220071059.jpg more fosdem pics \o/ | |
| <DaveMorris> loudmouthman: whats it like living where you are? | |
| <loudmouthman> nice polo popey <grin> | |
| <loudmouthman> davemorris.. loud. | |
| <loudmouthman> of where not who ! | |
| <DaveMorris> the whole town? | |
| <loudmouthman> Horsham . well its the plaec where fun came to die. though Micheal Caine started his acting career here. Diana Dors used to live here and Carl Cox might buy you a beer if your drinking down the star. | |
| <constrictor> i got into one of my distro tasting moods this weeked | |
| <constrictor> i tried BSD for all 2 hours | |
| <constrictor> and then Knoppix 5.1.1 | |
| <constrictor> i liked beryl on there | |
| <jayteeuk> Which BSD and what did you think? | |
| <GazzaK> popey, are you using a apple lapdog? | |
| <popey> i was | |
| <popey> didnt take a lappy with me | |
| <mrben> popey: that link is dead for me :( | |
| <popey> mostly just used my pda to chat and check mail | |
| <popey> what link? | |
| <mrben> wait - working now | |
| <mrben> the matthewgrove one | |
| <mrben> but it's up now | |
| <GazzaK> wooo OLPC http://bandwidth.matthewgrove.co.uk/phone/2007-02-25/resized_250220071084.jpg | |
| <popey> yeah | |
| <popey> the OLPC talk was really really good | |
| <GazzaK> they look cool, my niece would love one | |
| <GazzaK> was it a working model? | |
| <popey> yes | |
| * mrben would've killed to be able to take one out to Mozambique | |
| <GazzaK> did it run well, ie no problems? | |
| <popey> it is only a beta test machine | |
| <popey> the next beta (3) comes out shortly | |
| <popey> then release is this year | |
| <popey> some amazing stats about the OLPC were given out | |
| <GazzaK> like? | |
| <popey> one mo, baby in hand | |
| <GazzaK> awww | |
| * GazzaK is broody | |
| <GazzaK> hey Seeker` | |
| <popey> ok, some interesting nuggests I picked up. | |
| <popey> Jim Gettys has given this talk numerous times, there were very few questions because he explained everything so well.. | |
| <popey> he shot down many of the usual arguments that people have against the OLPC during the talk | |
| <popey> target market is 1.5 Billion kids.. | |
| <popey> they only get about 5 years of schooling before they have to go to work | |
| <popey> so these are really young kids, not teenagers | |
| <popey> for many the laptop would be the only source of light in their house | |
| <popey> they often have no electricty at school, or maybe one room that does | |
| <constrictor> jayteeuk i tried freeBSD | |
| <constrictor> it was fine | |
| <popey> the laptops need to consume very little power | |
| <constrictor> installed without a hitch | |
| <constrictor> it was very very security-focused | |
| <popey> modern laptops consume around 25W for just the panel, this is waaay too much, they are targetting 1-3W | |
| <popey> the display is amazingly readable in bright light - many kids taught outside so that is important | |
| <jayteeuk> constrictor: And from a usability perspective? | |
| <constrictor> umm | |
| <constrictor> i think that's why i lasted only 2 hours | |
| <jayteeuk> As bad as that? | |
| <constrictor> i think i didn't have enough patience | |
| <constrictor> i would have sworn that i installed the gnome desktop environment during configuration | |
| <constrictor> when it started up i didn't know what to do | |
| <constrictor> not that i'm intimidated by command lines, it's just that when i decided to startx i got something else | |
| <jayteeuk> My first UNIX OS (at home) was nearly NetBSD. | |
| <constrictor> and then i went to the freeBSD forums | |
| <constrictor> my goodness | |
| <jayteeuk> I wonder how things would have panned out if I'd had better quality floppies. | |
| <constrictor> the process to install one bit of software required that you recompiled your kernel | |
| <constrictor> i guess when you use *BSD you really have to know what in the hell you want to install and make a list of all of them before you actually do it | |
| <daviey> constrictor, it took me a month to know that a) i had a window manager installed, and b) i could load it with startx | |
| <constrictor> daviey the window manager i got was not the gnome i thought i had installed | |
| <daviey> constrictor, hell - i can't remember what i had. But i was impressed | |
| <Seeker`> hmm | |
| <Seeker`> I think I may have worked out why beryl doesn't work | |
| <jayteeuk> Because she's lazy? | |
| <constrictor> lol | |
| <AndrewWilliams> haha | |
| <popey> http://gallery.netvis.co.uk/main.php?g2_itemId=4096 \o/ more fosdem pics | |
| <mattl> was it good? | |
| <popey> yus | |
| <popey> very | |
| <popey> OLPC talk was one of the better ones | |
| <popey> but I also enjoyed the one about running debian on the linksys nslug thing | |
| <CieD> o/ | |
| <popey> yo CieD, you were missed | |
| <CieD> Al have you bought one yet | |
| <CieD> ho-hum | |
| <CieD> the joys of work | |
| <popey> no, not yet | |
| <popey> the guy was talking about the two separate projects | |
| <CieD> I'll bring mine along to the LUG meet | |
| <popey> one running linux entirely off flash | |
| <popey> the other was booting linux off the flash but then having the OS on the USB connected disk | |
| <mattl> popey: was rms there? | |
| <CieD> yeah, and the other... yep | |
| <popey> I would rather do the former myself | |
| <popey> mattl: no | |
| <CieD> the former is limited by onboard memory thoguh | |
| <popey> yes | |
| <popey> but for just a simple file server should be okay | |
| <CieD> so with a nice 80Gb 2.5" disk attached | |
| <popey> he knew is stuff, showed a few different devices | |
| <CieD> it does everything | |
| <popey> nice | |
| <CieD> how was the curry | |
| <popey> very very good | |
| <mattl> popey: olpc is pretty sweet. i'm looking forward to getting mine. | |
| <Norf-ubu> morning | |
| <DaveMorris> we are all doomed | |
| <DaveMorris> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/02/26/windows_boxes_at_sea/ | |
| <daviey> puts a new meaning to BSOD eh? | |
| <mrben> it can't _really_ be called Windows for Warship, surely? | |
| <DaveMorris> no, its called Windows on waships - WoW | |
| <DaveMorris> 2nd time today | |
| * daviey fell through the gap in the split | |
| *** Pricey is now known as PriceChi1d | |
| *** PriceChi1d is now known as PriceChild | |
| <GazzaK> popey, Virgin media are gonna lose sky one, eeek | |
| <mattl> GazzaK: and therefore, customers. | |
| <GazzaK> but I've just signed up to them | |
| <daviey> whooo there, who watches sky1 anyway? | |
| <daviey> other than the terrestrial channels; what do you actually watch? I would wathc UKgold only | |
| <mrben> sky1 is great when 24 is on | |
| <mrben> and shite the rest of the time... | |
| <mrben> oh, and Simpsons | |
| <mrben> there is enough on there to make me sad I don't have it, to be honest | |
| <daviey> so 2 programms? | |
| <mrben> but not sad enough to pay for it | |
| <mrben> Alias was on there for a while | |
| <mrben> luckily Heroes went to Sci-Fi | |
| <mrben> and then to BBC2 | |
| <DaveMorris> I make do with freeview and a mythtv box | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, same here | |
| <DaveMorris> oh and ahem tpb | |
| <daviey> tpb? | |
| <GazzaK> yeah, I'll be a bit annoyed, but still not enough to cancel and go grovelling back to sky (not after my last call to them) | |
| <DaveMorris> thepiratebay.org | |
| <DaveMorris> need my fixes of BSG | |
| <daviey> Naughty (but nice) | |
| <DaveMorris> heh, have the DVD's so far | |
| <DaveMorris> just can't wait :) | |
| <daviey> i can | |
| <Seeker`> is it easy to get tv-out working with ubuntu? And how do films etc. look when displayed on a tv? | |
| <DaveMorris> but myth is my friend, getting NCIS, CSI for me all the time | |
| <mattl> i wouldn't want to give any money to murdock. | |
| <DaveMorris> depends on the TV, I've got Svideo out working, was a pain as I had to compile the Openchrome driver after patching it, but it should be in the debs by now | |
| <DaveMorris> HDTV screens come with a vga/dvi input so they are even easier | |
| <mattl> popey: ping | |
| <Seeker`> DaveMorris: Is it watchable over svideo? | |
| <DaveMorris> easily | |
| <mrben> I don't have it under Ubuntu, but I do under my lappy | |
| <DaveMorris> about the same quailty as my DVD player | |
| <Seeker`> ah, cool | |
| <DaveMorris> but its better quality on a LCD/CRT | |
| <mrben> it always looks really crappy when you first bring it up, because you're used to seeing your computer running at 1400x1050 (or whatever) | |
| <Seeker`> I;m thinking of building a mythtv box at some point, for TV/ DVD | |
| <mrben> but when you watch a DVD or something, it looks no different | |
| <Seeker`> and running the output through a TV | |
| <DaveMorris> I'm using the via mini-itx boards on my front end | |
| * Seeker` was thinking of having the front end and back end in the same box | |
| <DaveMorris> work like a charm, very low noise/power and the graphics is done in hardware so only about 5% cpu load | |
| <DaveMorris> I did that to begin with, then decided to branch out | |
| <DaveMorris> my backend is a P450 with 3 tuner cards, records fine, a tad slow at doing comerical flagging though | |
| <mattl> do the tuner cards work well with free drivers? | |
| <Seeker`> how well does it work with seperate front end / back end systems? | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, I pefer one type to the other I have, worked out of the box | |
| <Seeker`> do you just connect them over the network? | |
| <Seeker`> and, if so, is there any noticeable lag because of the network connection? | |
| <DaveMorris> no lag | |
| <daviey> yeah, i had combined box but then decided to separate, putting the noisy backend in the loft | |
| <DaveMorris> I've got a wired connection, and can stream 2 front ends of a 100Mbit no probs | |
| <Seeker`> did you follow a guide for setting it up? | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, I'll find the link | |
| <Seeker`> ty | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, you mean apt-get install mythtv ? | |
| <Seeker`> daviey: I mean for setting up / configuring the system, including front ends | |
| <DaveMorris> http://parker1.co.uk/mythtv_ubuntu.php | |
| <daviey> parker1 is a good guide | |
| <daviey> but it may well be worth waiting for feisty to become stable; the packages are better | |
| <DaveMorris> I'm using feisty on my front end | |
| <daviey> the benefit of the new packages are to new users really, if your using existing settings then you won't feel it | |
| <Seeker`> I dont have the money to build it yet :P | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, yeah you do | |
| <DaveMorris> http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/27669 is the card I'd recommend | |
| <DaveMorris> I'm thinking of buying 2 to replace the dual tunner I'm having problems with | |
| <Seeker`> DaveMorris: Why do you have 3 cards? So you can have 3 frontends watching different things? | |
| <Seeker`> daviey: I really dont. | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, or record 3 channels at once | |
| <daviey> I have two nova-t's and they are are more expensive now that when i purchased them two years ago! | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, record 3 things at once, watch 1 live thing and record 2 others blah | |
| <daviey> tbh, i have 2 dvb cards. It's rare i have a clash that means i miss something | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, also - using radio times tv guide (from internet) you have 14 days of listing. So if it notices that something is repeated later; it will leave it and prioritise accordingly | |
| <Seeker`> cool | |
| <DaveMorris> daviey: You know if its possible to run the myth backend as a xen image? To make backup and recovery quicker | |
| <jayteeuk> Last I heard the Sky One / Virgin Media thing was just Sky posturing... has something changed? | |
| <popey> 14:02 < GazzaK> popey, Virgin media are gonna lose sky one, eeek | |
| <popey> i dont get tv from ntl | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, according to the bbc yes | |
| <GazzaK> popey, oh, thought you did | |
| <popey> no, just broadband | |
| <GazzaK> ahhh | |
| <popey> thinking about getting a tv drive from them though | |
| <jayteeuk> Link? | |
| <daviey> jayteeuk, there was a full page add from virgin basically saying sky were taking the micheal, if they don't reduce the cost - we drop it | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6396299.stm & http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6390655.stm | |
| <daviey> popey, why not join the mythtv bandwagon? | |
| <Seeker`> DaveMorris: Do you just control the frontends with keyboard / mouse as the tv card itself is in the loft? | |
| <popey> because mythtv wont do what the TV drive does | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, or a remote, I've got an ATI remote wonder 2 | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, no, use a remote - easy aswell | |
| <popey> also daviey I already have a freeview PVR - a Humax 9200T | |
| <daviey> popey, fair nuff | |
| <jayteeuk> Oh well, if it happens I'll do what the rest of the online community does and download 24 and Lost instead. | |
| <daviey> popey, http://www.telewest.co.uk/html/tvdrive/index.html what does tvdrive do that myth doesn't? | |
| <popey> HDTV | |
| <popey> over cable | |
| <daviey> thats true atm; i do hope they add firewire to the box | |
| <popey> firewire? | |
| <DaveMorris> I've got a keyboard/remote controlling mine | |
| <jayteeuk> Can you connect a MythTV box to the NTL feed? | |
| <popey> no, i dont believe you can jayteeuk | |
| <jayteeuk> I didn't think so. | |
| <DaveMorris> how does NTL connect to the TV? | |
| <popey> and in any case you would need a monster of a machine to decode the HD signal | |
| <popey> I am not prepared to have a monster pc in the lounge | |
| <jayteeuk> DaveMorris: Via RF or SCART. | |
| <popey> or even a big backend box | |
| <DaveMorris> I know you can hook up sky boxes to myth you see | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, trouble is you need to Digital->Analog------Analog->Digital | |
| <popey> DaveMorris: its not the same | |
| <DaveMorris> does anyone actually think IPTV will take off | |
| <DaveMorris> can't see how they are going to have the bandwidth for it all | |
| <popey> well given I have 10Mb broadband here, and NTL are trialling 20, 50 and 100Mb, I dont see why not | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, i do - but just had a huge row in #mythtv-users about it - so won't go into it now ;) | |
| <DaveMorris> but how will that bandwith be affected by people playing computer games, downloading, isos and smut, watching 2 or 3 channels per household | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, you won't stream it live - you pick your lineup | |
| <DaveMorris> ok, I was expecting it to be streamed | |
| <DaveMorris> as thats my perception of TV is | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, currently i can download an episode of eastenders in 10 minutes; when broadband reaches it's potential; it will be seconds | |
| <DaveMorris> daviey: But how many other people are using your exchange for the same purpose | |
| <daviey> Even if it is streamed; it could be 5 mins buffer; glitches could be easily absorbed | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, i'll go and count; brb ;) In honesty i agree; the current infrastructure couldn't cope with it | |
| <daviey> it's exciting times! | |
| <DaveMorris> I can see myth taking off easier though if a company tried to bundle and sell it to users | |
| <daviey> DaveMorris, it aint ready for general use yet | |
| <DaveMorris> but if say NTL decided to supplier you with the back end, pre configured, the frontends etc, and you just plug them into the network and they work | |
| <daviey> I'm undecided weather my parents can cope with it. Thought i might lend them a box whilst i go away; and see how they get on | |
| <DaveMorris> people would buy them | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, my bro uses it, but moans a bit when the backend crashes for some reason once a week (bloody dual tuner card) | |
| <popey> i liked the talk about Elisa at fosdem | |
| <daviey> it would open them up to reverse enginerring though. They would need soft QAM emulation; making free cable for whoever knows how | |
| <daviey> popey, geez - eliza has come on since i last saw it | |
| <DaveMorris> you could still need a card with the key on i, like it is now | |
| <popey> they want to integrate pvr into it daviey | |
| <popey> and eventually make a set top box | |
| <popey> (fluendo this is) | |
| <DaveMorris> daviey: I bet there is a way to unscramble the pay to view channels broadcast on freeview as well | |
| <daviey> popey, did they say who is funding it? | |
| <daviey> oh fluendo | |
| <popey> they are | |
| * mattl is not sure what to think about fluendo | |
| <popey> heh | |
| <popey> thought you might say that | |
| <daviey> y? | |
| <popey> they licensed mp3 | |
| <popey> they make proprietary software AIUI | |
| <popey> which finances their free stuff | |
| <daviey> i see | |
| <mattl> they also have proprietary Windows Media codecs now. | |
| <Seeker`> DaveMorris: What do you use to play back DVDs on the system? | |
| <daviey> i saw on there store | |
| <mattl> daviey: i'm opposed to proprietary software, in case you hadn't picked that up :) | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, we don't ;) | |
| <DaveMorris> my DVD player, but I use the mythVideo plugin and mythtv to play back avi files etc | |
| <mattl> i'm also opposed to popey, on medical grounds. | |
| <DaveMorris> s/mythtv/mplayer | |
| <popey> \o/ | |
| <mattl> ..but when i'm not at the doctors, i love him really. | |
| <daviey> The Internal mythtv player is good at playing dvd's now; but you need the CSS crack to play dvd's | |
| <daviey> obv. i don't recommend; mind you - is it illegal in the UK or just US? | |
| * Seeker` would want to be able to play DVDs on his mythtv frontends too | |
| * popey would not :) | |
| * popey would use a proper dvd player for that | |
| <daviey> Seeker`, you can | |
| * daviey would use mythtv for dvd's | |
| <daviey> why have 8 boxes under your tv? | |
| <Seeker`> popey: Why not? | |
| <popey> because I have a decent DVD player and amplifier | |
| <DaveMorris> same | |
| <Seeker`> popey: I dont. I have a £20 DVD player atm. | |
| <Seeker`> popey: If you had a mythtv box and didn't have the decent player / amp, would you play dvds on the myth box? | |
| <mattl> my computer has a better screen that my TV. | |
| <popey> that question is moot | |
| <popey> I dont have a mythtv box | |
| <mattl> can mythtv output over the network? | |
| <popey> i have a dvd player and a pvr | |
| <mattl> popey: you have a scale model of esr too, don't you? admit it. | |
| <daviey> MattJ, yes; it's designed to be | |
| <popey> mattl: in my shooting range, yes | |
| <mattl> MattJ: ignore daviey, he can't type ;) | |
| <mattl> popey: you have a shooting range? | |
| * daviey curses his tab key | |
| <popey> an imaginary one, yes | |
| <mrben> mattl: with myth you set up a server and a client | |
| <mrben> they can be on the same machine, or different machines | |
| <mrben> plus there is a web frontend that, I believe, will stream media too | |
| <jayteeuk> I think I had too much coffee. | |
| <AndrewWilliams> no such thing as too much coffee | |
| <AndrewWilliams> unless you've got caffeine jitters | |
| <AndrewWilliams> thats no fun :) | |
| <jayteeuk> A little. | |
| <jayteeuk> You don't know how many times I tried to type that before I got it right. :-P | |
| <AndrewWilliams> lol | |
| <jayteeuk> And all my plans of getting up to date with just about everything I needed to follow-up on today have gone out of the window. | |
| <MattJ> mattl: :P | |
| *** PriceChild is now known as PriceChi1d | |
| *** PriceChi1d is now known as PriceChild | |
| <rbs-tito> Does anyone here know much about web design (PHP/MySQL)? | |
| <mrben> I know a little bit; others will know more - what's the problem? | |
| <rbs-tito> Well, basically, I need a shopping system of sorts. | |
| <rbs-tito> But free | |
| <popey> oscommerce | |
| <rbs-tito> I'll check it out, I might need to modify it a bit though because it is a bit like Amazon or eBay, people request and donate OSS CDs to each other | |
| <rbs-tito> I don't think OSCommerce will be suitable | |
| <popey> sounds a bit bespoke | |
| <jayteeuk> Hey GazzaK, did you get those stickers? | |
| <bugbot> New on planetuk: Jono Bacon: The Big Red Recording <http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=907> | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: Bespoke? | |
| <popey> specific to a particular need, not generic | |
| <rbs-tito> Do you think I will need to pay for it? | |
| <rbs-tito> I know wha it means, lol | |
| <popey> i am not sure what you want to do | |
| <rbs-tito> t basically works like the Amazon marketplace but with Free and Open Source software. We will be shipping discs of Linux, Firefox, OpenOffice.org, etc. Anything under a free license. | |
| <rbs-tito> So, one user could list that they have 1 x openoffice for Windows CD, they are willing to ship to a few regions, for example. If another user went to the Windows Openoffice page, there would be one available. The user could request the CD, then somebody willing to ship to their region would dispatch it. It would also have a feedback/complaints system to try and stop users posting broken/wrong/inappropriate CDs. | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, not unless you posted me some | |
| <jayteeuk> GazzaK: I didn't, but I'm considering it. | |
| <GazzaK> :-) | |
| <jayteeuk> It might cost you though. | |
| <GazzaK> eek, how much | |
| <jayteeuk> Oooh, I dunno. Depends how many you want I suppose. | |
| <GazzaK> can you not just abuse company franking, like the rest of us | |
| <jayteeuk> Bwahahahahah! You overestimate my company's capacity for logical thought! | |
| <GazzaK> I'd only want two :'( | |
| * GazzaK kicks his server | |
| <GazzaK> work god damn you | |
| <jayteeuk> That would require me to catch a train to London St Pancras and the tube to Oxford Circus... it'd be cheaper for me just to pay the postage. :) | |
| <GazzaK> you work from home? | |
| <jayteeuk> I do. | |
| <GazzaK> lucky duck | |
| <GazzaK> I suppose I could pay postage :p /me bank transfers 30p to jayteeuk | |
| <jayteeuk> I have three stickers left... I have two machines currently running Debian Sarge, at least one of which I'm considering switching to Ubuntu Dapper, the other of which has a nasty Windows 98 badge on it. I also have a machine currently part-upgraded to Dapper. | |
| <jayteeuk> Possibly part-downgraded actually, I think it was running Sid once. But it's not currently running anyway. | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: would money change hands? | |
| <jayteeuk> So I might just send you two and keep one. | |
| <jayteeuk> And you can send me a beer in the post or something. | |
| <GazzaK> it might leak | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: No | |
| <jayteeuk> Spillage! | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: whats the motivation? | |
| <GazzaK> if I see you at a linux thing, ie linuxworld2007, I'll buy you a beer :p | |
| <popey> beer!? | |
| <jayteeuk> See, now we've caught popey's attention. | |
| <GazzaK> I'll buy you one too popey, but only the cheap stuff | |
| <popey> bah | |
| * popey doesnt drink the cheap stuff | |
| * popey has one bottle of belgian beer left over from the weekend | |
| <popey> \o/ Duvel | |
| <GazzaK> popey, you can watch me drink mine then | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: To spread freee software to those withut the bandwidth | |
| <loudmouthman> hahaah | |
| <GazzaK> unless of course I find a nice box of belgian chocolates in the post in the next few days, then I'll buy you a nice beer | |
| <jayteeuk> I could always get my brother to send off for some. :) | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: cant see that working | |
| <GazzaK> I could also stop being a lazy git and do that jayteeuk | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: ? | |
| <popey> surely people should pay at least for the blank discs | |
| <popey> no money changing hands.. | |
| <loudmouthman> things that make me laugh really hard and choke a little | |
| <jayteeuk> GazzaK: Send me your address and I'll stalk you. | |
| <jayteeuk> Damn, I mean send you some stickers. | |
| <loudmouthman> exhange 2003 does not support catch all address out of the box in any easy format . someone please point me to a place where im wrong on this ! | |
| <jayteeuk> Not stalk you. Never. I was found innocent. | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: There is a system like it in America, but all donations go to one place an are handed out. But that is time consuming and innefficient as you need to pay postage twice. | |
| <GazzaK> I like stalking.... I just wish popey would leave m some cookies out | |
| <GazzaK> his tree hurts | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: so you are suggesting that I burn 20 copies of ubuntu or whatever - at my cost - and then register on your site where people can ask me to send them (at my cost) a cd? | |
| <Bagnaj97> Jeeze, I log on and the first thing I see is GazzaK saying he likes stalking. I'm worried. | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: No, I'm suggesting if you have a spare disc you give it to somebody. I do it when people ask | |
| <popey> but postage? | |
| <jayteeuk> I don't mind doing it as a one-off... | |
| <popey> to Namibia? | |
| <GazzaK> Bagnaj97, :p | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, got pm? | |
| <popey> thats inefficient | |
| <jayteeuk> GazzaK: Yep, didn't you get the reply? | |
| <popey> send 40 of them to a school or lug is more efficient | |
| <GazzaK> nope | |
| * jayteeuk kicks Psi and ejabberd | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, you not be regisiterededed | |
| <GazzaK> damnit | |
| <jayteeuk> That'll probably be it. | |
| <jayteeuk> Anyway, I said "OK, if you see a blue Ford Escort hanging round outside your house, it's definitely not me, OK?" | |
| <rbs-tito> popey: What kind of school would accept a load of burned CDs? And I don't have a lug. Plus you couldn't go to a school or lug and say "I want a copy of Suse 10.2" | |
| * GazzaK is worried | |
| <GazzaK> jayteeuk, you'll never find my house :p | |
| <GazzaK> even my parents got lost 3 times, and I told them how to get to the house | |
| <jayteeuk> Well I hope the postman can. | |
| <GazzaK> yeah, he can (and he is cute) | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: I am just suggesting it is more efficient to send a load of CDs than one | |
| <popey> and the box could have a mix, one of every single distro | |
| <jayteeuk> Next time you're in Derby you can buy me a pint, how's that? | |
| <GazzaK> okay, that might very well be in the summer if we do another hairdressers convention (mx5 run) | |
| * popey wonders if GazzaK no longer lives in St Martins Close | |
| <popey> maybe no longer at number 19 | |
| <GazzaK> popey, I escaped | |
| <GazzaK> chavton no more \o/ | |
| <GazzaK> you damn stalker | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <GazzaK> was that a whois on kearley.net? | |
| <GazzaK> or did you really stalk me? | |
| <jayteeuk> You've got my address anyway GazzaK. | |
| <GazzaK> have I? | |
| <GazzaK> what did I sent to you? | |
| <mattl> popey: when are we going to sit outside GazzaK's house again? | |
| <mattl> oops. wrong window. | |
| <jayteeuk> Don't be coy. ;) | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <GazzaK> oh, that was you!!! I did not realise, it was the gimp suit you see | |
| <jayteeuk> It chafes as well. | |
| <rbs-tito> What about central distribution then, your points make sense Popey. That and the risk of dogy CDs/Porn being passed around, And addresses being used for spam. | |
| * GazzaK goes home, laters | |
| <jayteeuk> Night. | |
| <popey> rbs-tito: well that's been done, a store | |
| <rbs-tito> Which accepts donations and works for free? | |
| <popey> er | |
| <popey> thats a shop | |
| <popey> "accepts donations" = pay for | |
| <rbs-tito> Donations of stock, doesn't make a profit | |
| <popey> http://www.linuxemporium.co.uk/products/freecds/ | |
| <popey> been done | |
| <rbs-tito> Debian sarge? | |
| <popey> the principle is there | |
| <jayteeuk> Oh well, time for me to wander off. | |
| <jayteeuk> Might be around later, might not. | |
| <popey> cubuntu got a mention on our mailing list today :) | |
| <jamesbrose> whats cubuntu? | |
| <ziadoz> in gparted does the /boot flag mean the partition is active? | |
| <daviey> jamesbrose, cubuntu = unoffical console based flavour (server + extras) | |
| <jamesbrose> I see :] | |
| <daviey> would it be wrong of me to fork, a fork of a fork? | |
| <jamesbrose> depends what the fork is :P | |
| <GazzaK> woooo pancakes almost a week late \o/ | |
| <norf-ub1> g'day | |
| * X3N pokes popey | |
| <popey> ah | |
| * GazzaK pokes X3N | |
| <popey> --> prv | |
| <X3N> poking in private ;) | |
| <GazzaK> really, woo | |
| * sharperguy pokes self | |
| <Norf-ubu> g'day | |
| <GazzaK> g'day Norf-ubu | |
| <Norf-ubu> small niggley prob thats got me confused (easily done) | |
| <Norf-ubu> SB live card installed - no onboard sound - yet volume prefs show I have 2 devices | |
| <Norf-ubu> a SB Live 5.1 (alsa) (correct) and a Sigmatel (worrying) | |
| <Norf-ubu> do i disable the sigmatel ? and if so - how ? | |
| <tsmithe> Norf-ubu, no it's ok | |
| <tsmithe> are you in gnome? | |
| <Norf-ubu> so which do I use in prefs ? alsa or oss | |
| <tsmithe> alsa, always | |
| <Norf-ubu> right - ty | |
| <tsmithe> are you in gnome? | |
| <tsmithe> (there's more you need to change) | |
| <Norf-ubu> yes | |
| <tsmithe> ok | |
| * tsmithe isn't but hey | |
| <tsmithe> (xfce ftw!) | |
| <GazzaK> bath will get cold | |
| <tsmithe> there's a sound properties applet in system->preferences | |
| <tsmithe> open it, and select your default sound card | |
| <Norf-ubu> uhuh - there | |
| <tsmithe> (that runs `asoundconf set-default-card` in case you are interested in doing it on the cli) | |
| <tsmithe> [as if :P] | |
| <Norf-ubu> on all drop down boxes to "alsa - ..." | |
| <tsmithe> it should be at the bottom of the applet; there's a drop-down-list | |
| <Norf-ubu> done | |
| <tsmithe> excellent | |
| <tsmithe> that should set the "default" device in alsa to the sb live card | |
| <tsmithe> and thus, any apps which aren't hard coded to use a specific card (which they shouldn't be) should use that card | |
| <Norf-ubu> so where does the sigmatel thingy ma bob come from ? or is it a "linux" thing with drivers/devices ? | |
| <tsmithe> no | |
| <tsmithe> it's your motherboard's sound card, most likely | |
| <Norf-ubu> no onboard sound | |
| <Norf-ubu> for defo | |
| <Norf-ubu> its an Abit BE6II board | |
| <Norf-ubu> no other soundcard installed (even modem) | |
| <tsmithe> well, there is somewhere in there an ac97 codec produced by sigmatel :) | |
| <tsmithe> they mainly do on-board chips | |
| <Norf-ubu> which is what niggles me - 100% the only sound device physically is an SB Live 5.1 | |
| <tsmithe> ok | |
| <tsmithe> but it's not - i'm quite sure | |
| * tsmithe gets in the bath | |
| <Norf-ubu> enjoy | |
| <tsmithe> :) | |
| <Norf-ubu> < frantically does an lspci to look for hardware | |
| <Norf-ubu> <sneakily removes BT848 TV capture card :=" | |
| <tsmithe> Norf-ubu, haha | |
| <Norf-ubu> wha? wasnt me, didnt do it, i know nothing :P - cheers for the heads up | |
| <tsmithe> :) | |
| <tsmithe> no problemo | |
| <popey> w0000000000000000000t | |
| <butlershouse> yep thats what happens when you login as root. | |
| <butlershouse> cmon on fess up . | |
| <AndrewWilliams> well, i wondered how long it would be: http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/resignTony | |
| <butlershouse> i read that and thought ? huh Tiger ? | |
| <AndrewWilliams> lol | |
| <butlershouse> actually im at crossed feeling about the PM going . since a good friend will be loosing his job once the PM is no longer the PM and thats kind of a wierd feeling. | |
| <butlershouse> or rather he gets transferred on and out to other , more mundance assignments. but hes had a laugh or two . | |
| <butlershouse> cmon popey whats woot ? | |
| <popey> er, nuffink | |
| <popey> muhahahahaha | |
| <popey> http://www.itwire.com.au/content/view/9951/53/ | |
| <popey> well, its a step in the right direction | |
| <popey> "We are working with Novell to certify our corporate client products for Linux, including our OptiPlex desktops, Latitude notebooks and Dell Precision workstations. This is another step towards ensuring that our customers have a good experience with Linux on our systems," Dell stated. | |
| * popey wants a linksys nslu2 after seeing them at fosdem | |
| <butlershouse> heheh , popey you just know its never going to be as good as you hope though right . or am I being the cynic ? | |
| <popey> well, its better than nowt | |
| <popey> and might put cats amongst pigeons | |
| <popey> http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/ideastorm/ideasinaction?c=us&l=en&s=gen | |
| <butlershouse> yep i too voted for that when it was dugg. and yeah pigeons/cats it will indeed. | |
| <butlershouse> Id love to see MS come up with the reason not to reveal their secret source as to what we infringe on though. | |
| <popey> i suspect there are patents that it could be alleged that linux or linux based apps infringe | |
| <popey> wouldnt surprise me in the slightest | |
| <butlershouse> like the patent for clicking on stuff. or the parent for looking at things ? yeah theres going to be fog and fudge | |
| <popey> sure | |
| <popey> some will be obscure or downright bad | |
| <popey> but they will be there | |
| <popey> fact is linux can adapt very quickly | |
| <popey> offending code can be yanked and a new release put up | |
| <popey> problem is for all the stuff already out there | |
| <butlershouse> yeah well I think it was Halloween and then Get the Facts which keep showing how things change quickly . | |
| <butlershouse> but on the flip side whilst MS can be targetted by Alcatel re Mp3 it will be interesting to see where Alcatel takes the issue next. its a prett broad patent conversation relating to a patent and it will set some precendents. Certainly MS wont want to let that case set standards it does nt want to adhere to . | |
| <butlershouse> It does begin to feel though that the winds are changing in terms of copyrights/drm and patents . if only because its harder to supress content than it is to release it ( to screw with a phrase badly ) | |
| <butlershouse> I still cannot get over how overly complicated it is to manage a Exhangebox to handle catchalls and mail box scripting compared to Exim or Postfix. Im still impressed that people have been sold short on using the command line . | |
| <butlershouse> which reminds me , im visitng a SAP client tommorow Popey . | |
| <butlershouse> err thats talking Windows stuff and SAP not comlpications and stuff . | |
| <popey> heh | |
| <daviey> bah | |
| <popey> probably for the best, sap sucks :) | |
| <butlershouse> yeah but like Dyson , it pays well . | |
| <popey> not really any more | |
| <popey> it certainly used to | |
| <butlershouse> popey , shhhh your not supposed to let the beryl out of the bag. | |
| <butlershouse> so on a completely different note . I was going to suggest to the channel/maillist/forums that we make a concerted loco and international loco effort to sponsor Jono . See what I did there Notes/Tune <grin. | |
| <GazzaK> sponsor jono to do what? | |
| <butlershouse> hit things to make music | |
| <butlershouse> It seems that a concerted and well played effort on our part to orchestrate a campaign to gather the team in a harmonious attempt to raise funds and noise would be cool. | |
| <butlershouse> see http://www.jonobacon.org/ for more details. | |
| <butlershouse> im just miffed he didnt go for my sponosred cooked breakfast idea , I called it "Bacon and Eggs" | |
| <butlershouse> right thats enough bad yokes. im off to bed. | |
| <GazzaK> that would have been fun | |
| * GazzaK is watching "The IT Crowd" | |
| * daviey has gone right off python | |
| <tsmithe> whys? | |
| <daviey> I'm overiding a function and it aint overiding | |
| <daviey> ;( | |
| <tsmithe> :P | |
| * tsmithe goes to sleep | |
| <tsmithe> night :) | |
| <justifier> shout at it, i find that helps | |
| <daviey> justifier, i tried that | |
| <justifier> hrm, | |
| <daviey> i even swore, and threatend to re-write the code in java | |
| <justifier> did it even think about it? | |
| <daviey> naa, i even begged it | |
| <daviey> didn't even consider it | |
| <justifier> hrm, silly thing, anywhy im off to bed, im tired, nite | |
| <daviey> i'm making a ssh server with custom shell - and it's rubbish |
