*** jalrnc is now known as joao

*** joao is now known as jalrnc

<pochu> hello everybody!

<Rinchen> pochu, howdy

<pochu> hi Rinchen!

<pochu> howdy?

<Rinchen> pochu, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howdy

<pochu> wait

<pochu> :)

<pochu> oh!

<pochu> i'm fine

<pochu> i can't sleep

<pochu> hehe

<Rinchen> lol ...this is probably better: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/howdy

<Rinchen> Yeah I noticed...what time is it there? 3am?

<Rinchen> 4am?

<pochu> yep

<pochu> spain

<pochu> :)

<pochu> well, i went to bed on 2:15

<pochu> but on 3:30 i wake up

<pochu> 4am

<pochu> now

<Rinchen> Don't you have to go to work in a few hours? :-)

<pochu> nop

<pochu> :)

<pochu> i'm in the university

<Rinchen> You could use the Colorado method of going to sleep - Hot Cocoa

<Rinchen> excellent.

<pochu> and I have my classes on the evenings

<pochu> hot cocoa?

<pochu> I drank too coke this evening-night

<pochu> :(

<pochu> hey does anybody where can I find some images with open license?

<pochu> i'm searching for a cd image

<pochu> :)

<Rinchen> ah yes. I remember those days, I'd drink a 6 pack of Pepsi while doing homework and then wonder why I'm up at 5am :-)

<pochu> hehe

<pochu> :)

<Rinchen> pochu, re: images...yeah, let me find the site

<pochu> oh, thanks!

<Rinchen> there is a gfdl site around here somewhere

<pochu> or maybe without license :)

<Rinchen> I can't find the one I was looking for but I found these: http://www.pdfoto.com/ http://www.pdimages.com/

<pochu> are all of their images open licensed?

<pochu> or just some of them?

<Rinchen> ah, found the wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Public_domain_image_resources

<pochu> thanks Rinchen

<pochu> i'm taking a look

<Rinchen> Estoy alegre estar de servicio.

<Rinchen> you can also try http://www.openclipart.org/index.php which is on that wiki entry

<pochu> i think i've found a nice one!

<pochu> thanks Rinchen!

<Rinchen> excellent,

<pochu> it's for the iso testing team

<pochu> :)

<Rinchen> Fantastic ...give me a credit line for art research :-)

* Rinchen laughs.

<pochu> good night to everybody!

<pochu> and Rinchen: thanks a lot!

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<mitsuhiko> Seveas: pong?

<mitsuhiko> don't know. someone pinged me before my bouncer collapsed

<Seveas> it wasn't me

<mitsuhiko> oki

<mitsuhiko> Seveas: btw. i ported most of the django template engine to php

<mitsuhiko> maybe you are interested in it

<Seveas> neh

<Seveas> I got rid of php

<mitsuhiko> hehe

<mitsuhiko> Seveas: just noticed that you are using punbb

<Seveas> yeah, and wordpress

<Seveas> but I no longer write php myself

<mitsuhiko> yeah. it's pain in the ass

<JanC> mitsuhiko: so you're a masochist ? :)

<pochu> :)

<mitsuhiko> JanC: nope. there is something called legacy software

<mitsuhiko> stuff you still have to maintain

<mitsuhiko> having the same template engine in both python, ruby and php simplifies <buzz>interoperability</buzz>

<JanC> so, port the legacy software to python? :P

<mitsuhiko> JanC: i'm working on that since one year

<mitsuhiko> but a bulletin board software like pocoo takes some time :)

*** etank is now known as RoninX341

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*** omgponiezlol is now known as Admiral_Class

<furthur> hi all

<jenda> hey, furthur

* jenda prods the just parted jono

<mdke> mitsuhiko, zed, smurf: can you change the dns for www.ubuntu-it.org to 82.211.81.208 please? (wiki. and forum. to stay where they are for now) <-- for real this time

*** omgponiezlol is now known as Admiral_Chicago_

<pochu> hello!

<jenda> hello pochu

<jenda> pochu: nothing yet, AFAIK

<pochu> hi

<pochu> i think so

<pochu> :(

<pochu> well, let's wait

<pochu> he may be busy

<pochu> ;)

<jenda> yep

*** omgponiezlol is now known as Admiral_Chicago_

<pochu> jenda, Seveas: if you know any news about this, let me know

<pochu> :)

<jenda> sure

<Yann2> hi jono :)

<Yann2> jono > ping?

* mdke hands jono Mithrandir's content-less ping script

<jenda> jono: ping as well

<jono> heh

<jono> hey

<jono> havent got long, about to run

<Yann2> :)

<Yann2> oh, ok

<Yann2> then let's talk about it later :p

<jenda> jono: any news about the -es meeting

<jenda> ?

<jono> jenda: sorry got wrapped in meetings

<jono> I will arrange it tomorrow

<jenda> ok

<jenda> np

<jenda> pochu:^

* pochu is back

<pochu> jenda: yes?

<jenda> jsut that^

<pochu> oh yes

<pochu> :)

<mdke> Yann2: can you tickle zed/ mitsuhiko/ smurf for me?

<mdke> is there a mailing list or request system I can use for the dns change?

<Yann2> mdke > zed's just gone

<Yann2> and i haven't seen smurf for monthes

<Yann2> mitsuhiko > ping? :)

<mdke> :)

<Yann2> mdke > i'd suggest you to handle your dns somewhere else.. like xname.org? :)

<Yann2> well somewhere where you could do your dns changes yourself

<Yann2> I think it'd be better

<mdke> how do I arrange that?

<Yann2> that's why i pinged jono 10 minutes ago :p

<mdke> I'll ask smurf to arrange for the Canonical guys to handle it, maybe

<Yann2> for example

<Yann2> mdke > why don't you want to host your dns yourself? is there any reason behind this? or are you just too lazy? :p

<mdke> Yann2: because there is no guarantee that I will be around forever

<Yann2> mdke > with yourself I mean the ubuntu-it locoteam :)

<mdke> yeah, we could do it I guess

<JanC> maybe a web interface (or other interface, whatever) for a DNS service run by "Ubuntu" would be useful?

* mdke thinks a web interface for free ponies would be good too

<JanC> so that LoCoTeams can appoint a couple of people that have access to the DNS config

<Yann2> JanC > yup

<JanC> mdke: I don't want free ponies

<mdke> I do

<jenda> mdke: apply here: http://tinyurl.com/dl5vt

* jenda runs

<pochu> Seveas: ping?

<mdke> cruel jenda

<jenda> hehe

<pochu> hi kent

<kent> hi there. now, in what way are you having problems?

<pochu> it's a little complicate, but we are on that

<pochu> there is no visible leadership

<kent> oh, the opposite of ours then. we got in a huge catfight regarding censorship of the forums, and the way of the leadership. Though, I have not understood everything yet..

<mdke> classic stuff ;)

<mdke> we went through that 2 years ago with Italy

<pochu> we are having problems also like that

<mdke> every team does

<kent> end how does it usually end up? :)

<mdke> peace :)

<mdke> at Ubuntu-it things got quite bad, I spent several months mediating until another 2 or 3 really good guys came along to help, and we formed a team which imposed some structure on the group

<mdke> since then it's grown enormously and harmoniously

<Yann2> pochu > which locoteam are you from?

<pochu> spanish

<pochu> or I think that

<Yann2> ah, these ones ^^

<pochu> haha

<Yann2> tried to contact them a lot of times

<mdke> Spanish has always been surprisingly distant from the rest of the community

<Yann2> never managed to get an answer ^^

<Yann2> yup

<mdke> we never saw them around or contributing

<pochu> until I arrived

<pochu> :)

<pochu> Hola gente!

<pochu> ;)

<mdke> yeap, hola :)

<pochu> ciao Matt

<pochu> ;)

<pochu> mdke, why are you in the it loco?

<pochu> just curiosity

<mdke> I have an affinity with italy

<mdke> but I chip in in the UK team too

<kent> is there any preferred way of organising LoCo-teams? That is, is there ways you people by experience can say "No, thats never worked.. dont go there" ? :)

<jenda> Hello kent

<jenda> which loco are you?

<mdke> kent: it kinda depends on the size and personality. Quite a formal structure worked well for -it because it was full of such passionate people

<kent> hello there jenda :) The swedish one. You know, the terrible Vikings from the northern europe. :)

<pochu> just for fun: do you know loco in spanish means crazy?

<pochu> hehe

<pochu> :)

<mdke> yeah, that's intentional :)

<jenda> kent: nope... never heard of them.

<pochu> when I first saw loco I was confused

<pochu> :)

<Yann2> i'd say, big groups of up to ten people, with nobody standing a little over there and having a little responsability, is not a great idea, from my own experience

<jenda> in czech, it implies the locomotive ;)

<jenda> Welcome, P3L|C4N0

<pochu> hi , P3L|C4N0

<P3L|C4N0> hi people

<jenda> ooh, english ;)

<pochu> then kent, what are u going to do?

<Yann2> kent > i'd say, for each team, choose one leader, or 3 if the team is quite big

<Yann2> well it's the way we work in -fr, and it worked out quite well until now :)

<pochu> Yann2: but that's no so easy, at least at the beginning

<Yann2> but i know other teams are working differently, and are also as successful ;)

<Yann2> pochu > that's true :p

<jenda> Yann2: my opinion is that a council is better.

<jenda> Our team is rather small, and we have a 6 member council.

<pochu> jenda: what do you have in czech?

<pochu> oh

<pochu> but just a council, or like italy?

<jenda> Council chosen by current council, based on trustworthyness.

<Yann2> jenda > i meant, when a locoteam is sudivided in more teams (wiki, moderators, and so)

<jenda> pochu: not sure...

<jenda> Yann2: hmm

<mdke> we like the no leader approach

<jenda> yes

<mdke> it's worked nicely for a year and a half

<jenda> we do too, now.

<pochu> italy (mdke, tell me if I'm wrong) have a 5 or 6 (can't remember) person council, each of one is the leader of a team

<jenda> mdke: we=italy, right?

<mdke> yeah

<jenda> pochu: it's similar here

<pochu> oh well

<jenda> developed independently :)

<mdke> pochu: essentially yes. 5 people, each team is represented

<pochu> so you have some teams?

<pochu> and appart you are the contact

<Yann2> so you've team leaders though?

<jenda> We have the translation team...

<jenda> with a leader, yes.

<pochu> and there is leader, mdke?

<jenda> because we needed final translation decisions.

<mdke> Yann2: no, representatives. Some teams have administrators (normally more than one - l10n, forum mods, etc)

<Yann2> I mean, one contact for translations, one contact for... ?

<mdke> pochu: no leader.

<pochu> or there isn't?

<pochu> oh, well

<kent> pochu: well, not sure right now. Im reading the documenation right now. We have a scheduled meeting next sunday. As of some day ago, the leader has resigned. The agenda is kind of strange, as I know it we are to either elect a new leader or he will declare the LoCo nonexistant. But I am pretty sure those words are from a trubbled mind thats been trough some nights with to little sleep. Im confident we will elect new leadership, and as I read the d

<kent> ocumenation I will call him and declare my self willing to stand up for election. We have one more who is willing, so it will be solved some way.

<kent> sorry for the long message.

<jenda> The founder of the team sometimes still arbitrates things...

<Yann2> mdke > leaders, representative, call that the way you want :p

<mdke> kent: you don't need a leader :)

<Yann2> let's say a team contact :)

<jenda> mdke: sometimes, it's needed.

<jenda> mdke: to get it moving.

<mdke> Yann2: sometimes terminology is important. The forum has a leader, because there's one administrator. but the l10n and documentation groups don't have leaders

<mdke> they'll generally have 2-4 admins though, who do specific tasks

<mdke> like approval of new members for the translation team

<Yann2> our "leaders" are those who have effective administrator rights (for example, on the planet or on the forum), but they're not allowed to change things without the agreement of the team.. in fact the team decides, and then the leader applies

<Yann2> but I like your idea of a council with every team represented

<Yann2> we're moving toward this, too

* mdke nods

<mdke> as long as the community has a good way of getting their voice across

<jenda> yes

<pochu> kent: where is the meeting?

<pochu> on ubuntu-meeting or in the swedish channel?

<jenda> locoteam meetings should probably not be held in -meeting, due to their specific languages.

<pochu> yep

<jenda> unless they want to, i guess ;)

<pochu> but they can speak english

<jenda> even better ;)

<pochu> so all of we can come to the meeting and look

<pochu> :)

<pochu> hehe

<kent> pochu: in our channel.

<jenda> I agree with that - it's a _local_ team, not a language team.

<pochu> in sweedish?

<pochu> or english?

<pochu> or even spanish?

<pochu> :)

<jenda> hehe ;)

<Yann2> mdke > btw, have you ever had complicated moderation problems on your forums, and if yes, how did you solved them?

<mdke> Yann2: not to my knowledge, but you can ask Mizar

<mdke> it's difficult to have moderation problems when he is in charge, he's too wise :)

<Yann2> :p

<mdke> he trains up the mods

<Yann2> there are some things that are so hard to arbitrate

* mdke nods

<pochu> Yann2: as what?

<kent> mdke: Yann2 your way of handeling formal tasks is what i want our team to do. We sort of did that before. We had meetings on irc, where we decided on formal tasks and most of the time people with most respect and most eagerness end up doing what the meeting decided.

<mdke> yeah

<Yann2> in France there are people giving pork soup to homeless people... (ok that's not related to the forum, but a hard decision whether to allow it or not)

<mdke> got an off-topic forum?

<Yann2> ahm. 2.

<mdke> heh

<mdke> we have 2 as well

<Yann2> one for discussions. one for discussions over 5 pages ^^

<pochu> hehe

<Yann2> and well, a half trash forum

<Yann2> where we move posts we don't like, but wouldn't delete without giving them a chance

<Yann2> posts older than a few weeks gets deleted in that one ^^

<pochu> mdke, Yann2, jenda: how often do you do loco meetings, as well as council/admin group meetings?

<mdke> quite rarely. But we recently began discussing council stuff openly on the forum

<Yann2> pochu > pretty often, a year ago. barely, now :/

<pochu> barely?

<Yann2> i'd say, when needed :)

<mdke> Yann2: we have one tech related off-topic forum, and one totally off-topic one :)

<Yann2> well, really rarely

<pochu> oh, well

<pochu> my english is poor

<mdke> no it isn't

* pochu is here to learn

<pochu> hehe

<Yann2> maybe my word was wrong, i'm not good neither :p

<pochu> mdke: what means tech related off-topic?

<Yann2> mdke > well, we have a tech-related stuff forum too ^^ :D

<pochu> l'ubuntu bar?

<pochu> Il nostro Bar Informatico dove discutere di argomenti riguardanti Ubuntu, Linux ed Informatica.

<pochu> hehe

<mdke> pochu: that's it

<pochu> mdke: is that the tech relate..

<pochu> ...

<pochu> oh well

<mdke> yes

<pochu> you were faster

<pochu> :)

<mdke> Bar Sport is the totally off-topic one

<pochu> I see

<pochu> http://forum.ubuntu-it.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=71325524ac48059b184ff8c4ced6f72e&#12

<pochu> if someone else wants to take a look

<mdke> Bar Sport in Italy is the phrase which describes those crazy conversations old italian men have in bars

<pochu> Bacheca eventi?

<pochu> oh I see

<mdke> meetings, events, conferences

<pochu> Spanish and Italian are quite similar

<pochu> :)

<pochu> 319.362 Posts in 43.973 Topics da 16.647 Utenti

<Yann2> we have a "News concerning free software", a "cafe" which is off topic, a "to be or not to be" for really long topics so they don't get upped every 2 minutes, and a "transitory" where topics get deleted after some time, ideal for tests and some bad posts, but not so bad we would delete them

<pochu> that's fine

<pochu> hehe

<jenda> pochu: we've had one meeting so far.

<jenda> other than that, we discuss on the mailing list.

<jenda> we have a private 'core' mailing list, for the council.

<pochu> oh, well

<pochu> but mdke you in the italian loco discuss everything publicly, don't you?

<pochu> on the forums, for example

<mdke> we do now yeah

<pochu> how does that work?

<Yann2> the problem is, some things just can't get discussed publicly

<mdke> http://forum.ubuntu-it.org/index.php?board=40.0

<Yann2> just for that you'd need some kind of core, trustful team

<mdke> Yann2: we do that by email

<pochu> oh, and another question to mdke

<pochu> :)

<pochu> it's about the ubuntu italian members

<pochu> hehe

* mdke nods

<pochu> do you think that's working well

<mdke> we just started it 3 days ago

<Yann2> mdke > imagine now, an editor will soon launch a book, but don't want the news to be spread... an online store wants to sell pcs with ubuntu, but don't want the news to be spread...

<pochu> and it's really a big differences between after and before having that?

<pochu> oh

<mdke> Yann2: so email works for that

<pochu> didn't know

<pochu> hehe

<mdke> pochu: but it creates enthusiasm, yeah

<pochu> that's why there are so less ubuntu-it members

<pochu> hehe

<pochu> :)

<Yann2> mdke > and who would they mail, then?

<mdke> also it makes people feel part of the comunita

<mdke> Yann2: we use consiglio@ubuntu-it.org

<Yann2> ok :

<Yann2> same thing here ^^

<pochu> mdke

<mdke> yo

<pochu> and who says if an ubuntu-it member candidate joins or not?

<pochu> the concilio?

<pochu> or all the ubuntu-members?

<pochu> well

<pochu> the question should be

<mdke> the council, as informed by everyone

<pochu> who decides wether a candidate becomes a an ubuntu member or not, the CommunityCouncil or all the members?

<pochu> (in the international community)

<mdke> CC

<pochu> oh well

<pochu> the other way would be a little slow, don't you think

<pochu> ?

<pochu> ^_^

<pochu> hehe

<mdke> yeah

<pochu> @schedule Madrid

<pochu> oups

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