| *** apokryphos changes topic to " Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://www.ubuntu-uk.org | Ubuntu FAQ: http://help.ubuntu.com/community/CommonQuestions | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/Gallery/Members add your picture | Next UKTeam Meeting here on 27th November 2006 from 9.30pm | Signed UKTeam Tshirt now on Auction" | |
| * chaddy awakens | |
| <popey> moooooooorning | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> .o/ | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> Is it wrong that I want the support emails to go away after only a day? | |
| <mrben> morning all | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hello | |
| <GazzaK> Good Morning Ubunteros | |
| <GazzaK> good answer popey https://answers.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+ticket/2528 | |
| <GazzaK> Good Morning jono & CieD | |
| <CieD> Morning :) | |
| <CieD> *yawn* | |
| <CieD> even the ride into work has failed to wake me up | |
| <jono> heya | |
| <GazzaK> train or car? (as a car journey half asleep is scary) | |
| <AndyR> cycle? | |
| <CieD> Motorbike of course :) | |
| <CieD> and now I'm surfing half asleep.... I need coffee | |
| <GazzaK> when I had a motorbike - I always got to work on a high (mostly due to being scared for my like of the way in - like a scary fairground ride) | |
| <CieD> :) Yeah, I'm normally quite high after it... I just need some more sleep | |
| <binary2k2> last time i was on a motorbike, it caught fire, so i havn't been on one since | |
| <GazzaK> lol | |
| <CieD> fun | |
| <GazzaK> eek, scary motorbike | |
| <binary2k2> yeah, before it was on fire, the breaks fell off too. bad experience :p | |
| <GazzaK> yeah, gotta stay off those czech motorbikes | |
| <CieD> or maintain it a bit better | |
| <binary2k2> it was a mates, i was just a pasenger | |
| <GazzaK> hey Seeker` morning | |
| <Seeker`> heya | |
| <Seeker`> how are you? | |
| <GazzaK> okay, tired | |
| <Seeker`> i know the feeling :P | |
| <GazzaK> want a nice fry up breakfast, but thats not gonna happen,so i'll just starve as normal | |
| <Seeker`> aww | |
| <Seeker`> i had cereal for breakfast | |
| <Seeker`> and i have a tesco puff pastry mince pie for breakfast 2 | |
| <AndyR> CieD, what bike do you have? | |
| <CieD> Honda Africa Twin, a 750cc Big Trailie | |
| <AndyR> thats a tall persons bike, no good for me | |
| <CieD> it's great fun | |
| <CieD> well I have a 30" inside leg and I'm fine on it | |
| <AndyR> i have an aprilia rs250 | |
| <CieD> is it locked away for winter? | |
| <AndyR> in back garden | |
| <CieD> I'm just working out how to put a server on it for the hantslug meets | |
| <AndyR> its not fun on slippery roads | |
| <GazzaK> I would fall off an africa twin :-( | |
| <GazzaK> I need a monkey bike I'm so short | |
| <CieD> jeez, I've only been riding for a year and it's just great | |
| * CieD checks this is #ubuntu-uk and not #dwarf-riders | |
| <AndyR> the power delivery is a bit erratic for inclement weather | |
| <Seeker`> how short is short? | |
| <GazzaK> erm, I wear 29" length trousers | |
| <AndyR> im 5' 5" | |
| <GazzaK> i'm 5'8" | |
| <GazzaK> yay, I'm taller than AndyR | |
| <GazzaK> :-) | |
| <AndyR> and also wear 29" trousers | |
| * Seeker` has about 30-31" trousers, and i'm just over 5' 10" | |
| * AndyR considers going to work | |
| * GazzaK is at work, eeek | |
| * mattl is at work :( | |
| <CieD> me too | |
| <GazzaK> all IT people? | |
| <CieD> nope | |
| <mattl> i'm in especially early today tho. | |
| <AndyR> i dont normally start til 9:30 | |
| <GazzaK> I'm a Sys Admin - what do you do? | |
| <mattl> GazzaK: I have a computer, but I don't work in IT. | |
| <GazzaK> lucky mattl | |
| * Seeker` is also at work | |
| <AndyR> im a scientist, it says so on my job description :) | |
| <mattl> i'm researching mobile web applications. | |
| <Seeker`> mattl: Where do you work? | |
| <mattl> Leeds. | |
| <Seeker`> cool | |
| * Seeker` will be researching mobile applications later this year | |
| <mattl> but yeah, accessibility is my main thing. | |
| <Seeker`> brb | |
| <Seeker`> bk | |
| <mattl> o | |
| <mattl> yo | |
| <popey> thanks GazzaK | |
| <popey> morning | |
| <twager> Hi.....Wonder if you can help with a vid problem ?? | |
| <Seeker`> what problem? | |
| <twager> I have just installed Ubuntu on another box and when I goto bbc or cnn and try to play a vid | |
| <twager> the clip starts to load and then stops and restarts.... | |
| <twager> I know the box is ok as Myah Linux is ok on it | |
| <Seeker`> what sort of video? | |
| <twager> Just a news clip.....Works ok on all the other boxes I have installed it on... | |
| <Seeker`> what format is the video? | |
| <popey> realvideo if it's BBC i suspect | |
| <twager> It is realvideo.. | |
| <Seeker`> do you have realplayer installed? | |
| <popey> it's in the repository i believe | |
| <mattl> Don't install RealPlayer! Use mplayer instead. | |
| <twager> Yes and I have also tried Mplayer with the same result | |
| <popey> i prefer realplayer to mplayer myself when watching real content | |
| <mattl> popey: realplayer's proprietary! | |
| <popey> yes | |
| <mattl> argh! | |
| <popey> so is my nvidia driver | |
| <popey> as is my palm | |
| <popey> my pvr | |
| <popey> my sky digibox | |
| <popey> my washing machine | |
| <popey> my car | |
| <popey> etc | |
| <popey> popey != RMS | |
| <mattl> when did it suddenly become cool to promote proprietary software? | |
| <popey> in what way am I saying it's cool | |
| <popey> I am merely answering the persons question | |
| <mattl> i'm sure RMS's washing machine and car would be proprietary.. | |
| <popey> if he had one | |
| <popey> which I bet he doesn't :) | |
| <mattl> i just don't think it's appropriate to even suggest people should install proprietary software. | |
| <popey> that's your opinion and I'm glad you're able to express it | |
| <popey> if that's the case then why is it in the repository | |
| <popey> ubuntu != gnewsense | |
| <popey> why does the ubuntu documentation have lots of stuff about proprietary stuff in it | |
| <popey> I am a pragmatist | |
| <mattl> i don't know why. it shouldn't. | |
| <popey> Well fact is it does. | |
| <mattl> you can be pragmatic, without promoting something that isn't useful. | |
| <popey> but realplayer *is* useful | |
| <popey> for those people who want to watch real video streams | |
| <mattl> it isn't | |
| <popey> I will gladly now try mplayer for the same thing | |
| <popey> and if it can do the same job I will promote it | |
| <mattl> people should be complaining about the bbc using real video, rather than installing realplayer. | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> grr, nasty work | |
| <popey> I don't feel the need to put my fingers in my ears and shout "aaaarghh proprietary code!" every time someone asks for something to be made to work | |
| <popey> yes, agreed | |
| <popey> but that's not what twager asked is it? | |
| <twager> I find the people I put Linux on for dod not bother what it is as long as it will do what they need | |
| <mattl> if someone wants something to work, then we should get it working with free software, or not at all :) | |
| <popey> that is your opinion | |
| <twager> All are pensioners and mostly not computer literate and also find Windows too much | |
| <popey> make my video card do 3d please mattl | |
| <popey> with only free software | |
| <mattl> what card do you have? | |
| <popey> I have Nvidia 7900GT | |
| <popey> and Nvidia 6800Go | |
| <popey> also please make my DVB-T card work | |
| <mattl> okay, then i suspect right now, they don't work with free software. you would have to surrender your freedoms to use them. | |
| <popey> indeed | |
| <popey> and personally I am willing to do that right now | |
| <popey> it pains me | |
| <mattl> i'm not going to suggest you do that, instead i'll make you aware of the reasons why you shouldn't. | |
| <popey> and I will be happy the day that nvidia open their driver | |
| <popey> yeah, I understand that position | |
| <mattl> but ultimately, you're an adult and intelligent, and if you decide to do it, i can't stop that. | |
| <popey> this is somewhat high and mighty for an end user | |
| <mattl> it's not high and mighty. it's just about educating someone - offering no support or advice or help for proprietary software on GNU/Linux is the best way you can help free software. | |
| <DaveMorris> the Huagague DVB-T cards have OSS drivers | |
| <popey> DaveMorris: I don't have that card | |
| <popey> look, I understand the whole free software debate, I sympathise, I really do, but fact is some stuff doesn't work yet in free software | |
| <popey> I will make people aware of the issues | |
| <popey> yeah, on this occasion I didn't | |
| <DaveMorris> popey: I know what you mean about properiety drivers, we need the nvidia 3d at work so we have to use it, no choice | |
| <popey> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats would have been the correct thing to do for twagers situation | |
| <popey> as it explains the proprietary implications | |
| <mattl> DaveMorris: if you need it, then you might choose to install it, but i don't think anyone should ever advise you to do so. | |
| <popey> depends how you word it mattl | |
| <popey> "If you want 3d then you have to install the binary blob, if you are happy doing that given the implicatinos etc etc " | |
| <DaveMorris> I was about to say that | |
| <twager> I have been there and as I said I have it working ok on about twelve systems but one refuses to play | |
| <mattl> I'd say something like 'To accept a proprietary driver is to accept something that goes against the efforts of our community. Not installing proprietary software is to make the right choice.' | |
| <mattl> If they want to, they will, but I would never even suggest they should. | |
| <popey> ok, now we have that sorted | |
| <popey> please direct me to some documentation on how to play realplayer streams with free software? | |
| <mattl> It might seem a little zealous to some, but when we have Ubuntu offering people RealPlayer, I think we have to be very careful. | |
| <mattl> popey: Do you have mplayer? | |
| <popey> i can install anything, so yes | |
| <mattl> You might need to compile the latest version, as I'm not sure what's in your version of Ubuntu. | |
| <popey> heheh | |
| <popey> so assume I am joe-numpty for a moment | |
| <popey> you're suggesting they recompile mplayer to watch the bbc? | |
| <mattl> yup. | |
| <mattl> nope. | |
| <mattl> i'd go and find out what version of mplayer they have available first :) | |
| <popey> 2:0.99+1.0pre8-0ubuntu8 | |
| <popey> is the package version | |
| <mattl> that's probably okay. | |
| <popey> mplayer reports the same when I run it | |
| <mattl> so try mplayer <url> | |
| <DaveMorris> if your using firefox/mozilla you'll prob need the mozilla-mplayer plugin | |
| <popey> Win32 LoadLibrary failed to load: avisynth.dll, /usr/lib/win32/avisynth.dll, /usr/local/lib/win32/avisynth.dll | |
| <mattl> popey: do you have win32 codecs installed? | |
| <popey> w32codecs is already the newest version. | |
| <mattl> i don't and it works for me. | |
| <mattl> but i'm on powerpc. | |
| <twager> Thanks for the help will have to install Myah for him | |
| <mattl> Myah? | |
| <twager> Myah Linux...Slack based | |
| <mattl> ohh, okay. | |
| <popey> hehe | |
| <popey> i just managed to get mplayer-plugin to tune in | |
| <popey> *exactly* when the pips were going | |
| <popey> thank you mattl, i have now removed realplayer from this pc | |
| <mattl> awesome. how does it feel? :D | |
| <popey> haha | |
| <DaveMorris> mattl : you got an OSS BIOS installed then? | |
| <mattl> i do. | |
| <mattl> OpenFirmware. | |
| <mattl> It's BSD licensed. | |
| <DaveMorris> was it hard to install etc, I'm just worried about screwing my boards up | |
| <mattl> DaveMorris: it came with my Macintosh... I've no experience of using any of the BIOS' for x86 machines, but I know we've been doing it at the FSF. | |
| <mattl> baughj@fsf.org might be able to help answer any questions you've got. | |
| <Seeker`> Has anyone else heard about the modifications to the Computer Misuse Act? | |
| <DaveMorris> where it's an offense to get a site slashdotted :) | |
| <Seeker`> basically | |
| <Seeker`> but it also could make it illegal to report security holes | |
| <DaveMorris> also about not been able to distribute tools which could aid hackers, such as the tools researchs distubuite | |
| <Seeker`> yeah | |
| <Seeker`> the actual act states that it is illegal to suppy any program or data held electronically with the intent, or belief that it is likely to be used to break sections 1 or 3 of the computer misuse act | |
| <DaveMorris> I guess that means distributions may have to host certain packages outside of the UK, similar to how they host the encryption stuff outside of the US | |
| <DaveMorris> but you allowed to send it in the post, so I guess you make reports of secuirty flaws via the post/public annoucmentrs in national papers | |
| <Seeker`> yeah | |
| <mattl> "Dan would later learn that there was a time when anyone could have debugging tools. There were even free debugging tools available on CD or downloadable over the net. But ordinary users started using them to bypass copyright monitors, and eventually a judge ruled that this had become their principal use in actual practice. This meant they were illegal; the debuggers' developers were sent to prison." - Richard Stallman, The Right To Read. | |
| <Seeker`> although most newspapers have online copies, which would violate the act (as my friend pointed out) | |
| <DaveMorris> Well the goverment in the UK is kinda useless with technology | |
| <DaveMorris> I wonder if Microsoft Windows breaks this act? As it can easily be used to break the relevant sections | |
| <Seeker`> hmm | |
| <Seeker`> could it be used to force companies to patch known exploits | |
| <Seeker`> as if they are made aware of an exploit, they are distributing software that is likely to be exploited | |
| <DaveMorris> thats an interesting take on it | |
| <popey> \o/ another support ticket answered | |
| * popey enjoys doing that | |
| <DaveMorris> hehe | |
| <DaveMorris> you know if the latest kernel is working with the via mini-itx boards yet? | |
| <popey> hmmm | |
| <popey> i have a via machine at home but not booted it in a long time | |
| <popey> ping me later and I will stick an edgy cd in it | |
| <DaveMorris> cheers | |
| <LoudMouthMan> afternoon all | |
| <DaveMorris> Seeker: We can always share the data on this http://www.theregister.com/2006/11/23/rvd_system/ after all its just printed onto paper | |
| <LoudMouthMan> im on the end of one of the fanciest shotgunned SDSL connections I have ever laid eyes on . | |
| <DaveMorris> whys that then? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Davemorris . because a clients moved into managed offices and the support company here have some really heavy duty stuff just for serving 40 computers! | |
| <popey> moo | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> woof | |
| <LoudMouthMan> bugger | |
| <GazzaK> please | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> I feel like i'm in mission:impossible today :( | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> the I.T. Dept S.W.A.T. team are on the prowl for improper internet usage, and I suspecting ssh-ing home to use IRC would be frowned upon :( | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Gazzak down boy, sheap why ? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> so now is not the time to send sound files that might autoplay ? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> stuff like "ALARM ALARM : EXTRUDER ALERT" | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> LoudMouthMan: you can try. Work PC is on mute :) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> sheepeatingtaz nah i was being ironic. | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> gotcha ;) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> me . im trying to work out the how and the why these two sonic firewalls are configured | |
| <X3N_> people who have stereos like this one should be castrated: http://blog.dna.co.uk/jvc_stereo3.jpg | |
| * sheepeatingtaz ducks out again | |
| * X3N_ scowles at the noise from upstairs | |
| <X3N_> i mean come on.. | |
| <DaveMorris> I assume you can't say you need ssh for you job | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> DaveMorris: No. I'm not important enough for tools like ssh. As it is, I'm having to go through port 443. | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <DaveMorris> what about a ssh client in a web browser to your home | |
| <grifferz> either way it is going to show up as a very long-running connection to port 443 | |
| <grifferz> which they will find, if they are going to go as far as looking at active tcp connections | |
| <popey> or you could use silenceisdefeat.org as mr revell does | |
| <grifferz> how are you going to avoid a multi-hour tcp connection to port 443? | |
| <GazzaK> but will they really care? | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> grifferz by using screen and logging on for a minute or so at a time, like I now | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> * I am now | |
| <grifferz> jesus you must be really addicted to irc | |
| <GazzaK> lol | |
| <X3N_> i'm using 443 as well, no one has noticed since i started in september | |
| <grifferz> "they'll never trace this call!" | |
| * GazzaK has a dsl line all for himself :p | |
| <popey> what's probably more problematic is that you could do a reverse tunnel to home | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> X3N_: Not Noticed, or not done anything about it? ;) | |
| * sheepeatingtaz dons tin foil hat | |
| <popey> then people from your home could pop up on your work LAN :D | |
| <X3N_> either way i'm happy | |
| <popey> where I work they have unrestricted access | |
| <popey> no ports blocked | |
| <popey> and one day the net slowed down because someone decided they would like to try bittorrent | |
| <GazzaK> we block all except http and a few others | |
| <popey> that was fun | |
| <GazzaK> irc is blocked on the main system :( | |
| <popey> nobody needs irc | |
| <popey> just ssh :) | |
| <DaveMorris> The uni work thinks they have irc blocked and loads of other things | |
| <DaveMorris> but certain parts of the network aren't blocked as much as other parts | |
| <VooDoo> hello all | |
| <popey> muahahahah | |
| <popey> competitive popey strikes again with the support tickets | |
| * VooDoo slaps popey with a wet fish | |
| <GazzaK> do you do any proper work popey ? | |
| <GazzaK> hello VooDoo | |
| <popey> of course | |
| <GazzaK> when? | |
| <DaveMorris> define proper work? | |
| <popey> answering tickets is actually pretty quick | |
| <popey> work that pays :) | |
| <GazzaK> DaveMorris, I cannot do that, I don't know | |
| <popey> I wrote a blog post about how to answer support tickets iirc | |
| <DaveMorris> got a link? | |
| <popey> well, I typed it up, but can't remember if I published it | |
| <popey> http://popey.com/Doing_my_bit_with_Ubuntu_Linux | |
| <DaveMorris> I need something else to distract me | |
| <popey> filter the support tickets showing only the open and/or answered ones and have a stab at a few | |
| <GazzaK> woo, I just did a bit more "work" woww | |
| <GazzaK> my job is so boring | |
| <GazzaK> how come the people I work with, who are on smaller sites than I, and looking at the logs, seem to be quieter than I am, take days to do things I take minutes over? | |
| <GazzaK> yet I still spend most of the day bored and messing on irc or barryboys.co.uk ? | |
| <DaveMorris> because your highly skilled or have a few shortcuts | |
| <DaveMorris> or of course they are just as bored as you and spend their time doing different things | |
| <grifferz> why don't you find a more challenging job then | |
| <popey> hahahaha someone has found my site by googling for black lace and agadoo | |
| <GazzaK> http://www.filecabi.net/video/worst-burgler-ever15.html lol | |
| <GazzaK> when I am busy (which actually does happen) it is great and very challenging, just when it is quiet it is not | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> GazzaK: Same situation for me here | |
| <grifferz> I complain about things at work a lot but really I love it, I just like to moan about unfortunate things that are part and parcel of it | |
| <GazzaK> yeah, don't we all grifferz | |
| <GazzaK> hello chrisbudden14 | |
| <GazzaK> how is uni going? | |
| <grifferz> however around this time last year in my last job I found myself constantly complaining about shit that really shouldn't be happening, and found myself becoming "One of those people" who complains but never acts on it, so I did force myself to go job hunting around christmastime | |
| <grifferz> fortunately the job market for IT people is pretty good these days | |
| <LoudMouthMan> well grifferz if you were down newbury way there might be some pocket money work available at this client given that their net config for shits. | |
| <GazzaK> yeah, I've never been out of work in my life, well apart from the dossing about I did as a newbie at 17 | |
| <LoudMouthMan> and by pocket money i mean good money for a sideline. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> ah moonlighting thats the word i was looking for .. .brains .. drying up | |
| <DaveMorris> where are you guys based then? | |
| * VooDoo is in Nottingham | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Well im sussex but working in newbury today . | |
| <grifferz> I work in central london | |
| <DaveMorris> I'm in Brighton, Sussex | |
| <popey> \o/ london | |
| <popey> spying on grifferz at lunchtimes | |
| <grifferz> and I am going to grab some sushi.. stay away popey! | |
| <GazzaK> i'm on an army base :p | |
| <popey> Mwaauahahahahahahahahhahaaaaaa | |
| <GazzaK> well, kinda | |
| <grifferz> excellent place to eb testing the internet usage policy, GazzaK | |
| <grifferz> send me your regards from guantanamo | |
| <GazzaK> well it's not MOD land yet!!! | |
| <DaveMorris> esp if your using ssh to get out and use irc | |
| <GazzaK> it's still a building site | |
| <GazzaK> but I do get to see cute squaddies all day, which is just a damn distraction - HTF am I supposed to concerntrate on work with them running about! | |
| <VooDoo> scratch your eyes out :) | |
| <DaveMorris> face away from the window | |
| <Seeker`> LoudMouthMan: whereabouts in Newbury? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> NEtqubate offices | |
| <Seeker`> i know where that is | |
| <Seeker`> i'm only just a couple of miles away | |
| <Seeker`> if that | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Seeker, are you able to help, would you be able to send me some sort of CV then i can add you to my list of local hands. | |
| <GazzaK> face away from the window - yeah like i'm gonna do that!!! | |
| <GazzaK> me and the tea ladys are like dogs on heat :p | |
| <Seeker`> help in what way? | |
| <popey> i face away from the window | |
| <popey> towards the attractive women in the office | |
| <LoudMouthMan> well general reboot the server, reconfigure the windows wkstns to connect to the domain, slap users with trout and sort out the firewalling! | |
| <Seeker`> i cant really, i'm already working full time at Vodafone | |
| <Seeker`> LoudMouthMan_: i cant really, i'm already working full time at Vodafone | |
| <LoudMouthMan_> Seeker . okay , well cheers anyway . | |
| <DaveMorris> you tried asking on the linuxjob mailing list? | |
| <Seeker`> does anyone know how well Xen should work on edgy? | |
| <DaveMorris> I have it working on Daper, not tried edgy | |
| <LoudMouthMan_> Wow , that was pleasant. An IT support guy working for the clients landlord that was actually helpful, knowledgeable and useful. gods they are rare | |
| * popey wishes he could read russian http://www.opennet.ru/opennews/art.shtml?num=8919 | |
| <popey> babelfish borks when i try to translate it | |
| <DaveMorris> you could always buy yourself a russian bride of the net who cpuld translate it for you | |
| <chaddy> pricey, ones that speak inglish | |
| <binary2k2> popey: mostly translated http://www.online-translator.com/url/tran_url.asp?lang=en&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.opennet.ru%2Fopennews%2Fart.shtml%3Fnum%3D8919&direction=re&template=General&cp1=NO&cp2=NO&autotranslate=on&transliterate=on&psubmit2.x=50&psubmit2.y=14 | |
| <popey> cool :) | |
| <popey> ta | |
| <binary2k2> no | |
| <binary2k2> problem | |
| <binary2k2> :p | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> popey, you know the last ticket I tried helping with (the sources.list one)? | |
| <popey> yes | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> In your opinion, would it be OK to post a follwo up asking which solution sorted him out? | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> So others who may search for teh same problem know which it was | |
| <popey> heh | |
| <popey> guess so. although I don't think it was yours ;) | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> I realise in hindsight, it was probably yours, but others reading it wouldn't necessarily | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <popey> true | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> Plus, I'd get mor Karma for posting it ;) | |
| <popey> hahah | |
| <popey> you loon | |
| <popey> quick, disconnect from irc.. they're coming! | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> hey, I was considering going through all the ones you had answered earlier and adding | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> ^^ do what he says | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> :) | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <popey> why not do what Jim Jones and williamst99 do and just reply with "if this solved your problem, please click solved" and gain millions of karma for doing it repeatedly | |
| <popey> I get like 10 mails in a row where those dudes have done that in a 5 minute stint | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> Because it irrates me that they do it :) | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> I want mine to be real karma | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> </steps off high horse> | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> Can I retract comments? | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> or answers, I should say | |
| <GazzaK> that sounds like a great idea popey | |
| * GazzaK runs off to cut and paste the above onto loads of popeys tickets | |
| <binary2k2> sheepeatingtaz: no, just post a comment after sayin "ignore that, it was crap" ;p | |
| <sheepeatingtaz> binary2k2: but surely that's bad karma ;) | |
| <chaddy> anyone know what the average karma is? | |
| <GazzaK> mine is 0 :-) | |
| <chaddy> I'm in the low thousands | |
| <chaddy> no idea what that means though, should I register people I've switched on to Ubuntu somewhere? | |
| <popey> you should tell them to ask their questins there, yes | |
| <popey> IMO | |
| * popey is hoping to catch up with dsas shortly | |
| <popey> dsas 7389044 | |
| <chaddy> good plan, popey | |
| <popey> popey 6347266 | |
| <apokryphos> karma changes with bug reports, patches etc | |
| <popey> and of course if you upload a stunningly good looking hackergotchi | |
| <popey> that's worth millions of karma | |
| <GazzaK> is it, so where is mine | |
| <VooDoo> afternoon | |
| <popey> moo | |
| <VooDoo> human to dog: what that round a tree? dog to human: BARK! | |
| <VooDoo> la la la | |
| <VooDoo> so how is everyone this afternoon? | |
| <Seeker`> tired | |
| <VooDoo> know the feeling can't believe its nearly 4pm | |
| <DaveMorris> feeling tired :( | |
| <VooDoo> well at least its nearly the weekend | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, we tend to be in the pub by 4pm on a Friday | |
| <VooDoo> sounds good to me. | |
| <VooDoo> even better if theres a wireless connection in it :) | |
| <DaveMorris> there is, and its free | |
| <VooDoo> wooho | |
| <VooDoo> down to Daves pub tomorrow then :) | |
| <DaveMorris> yeah, its on the coast as well | |
| <DaveMorris> welll, about a mile from the coast, but the city is on the coast | |
| <VooDoo> bugger too far :) | |
| <DaveMorris> shame | |
| <VooDoo> nottingham here.....few hours drive to any coast | |
| <AdonaiUK> margate here, right in the coast, ... | |
| <AdonaiUK> margate (Thanet, Kent) | |
| <DaveMorris> Well I'm in Brighton | |
| <VooDoo> lucky buugers....its grim up north [at the moment] | |
| <DaveMorris> dark and overcast here | |
| <AdonaiUK> DaveMorris: not very far | |
| <AdonaiUK> no clouds but chily in here | |
| <DaveMorris> VooDoo, you in Nottingham | |
| <AdonaiUK> lucky me not windy today. | |
| <VooDoo> DaveMorris: yes mate | |
| <DaveMorris> My rents live up that way and I noticed houses are alot cheaper, but whats the IT job market like up there | |
| <VooDoo> DaveMorris: depends on what you know...take a look at http://jobs.thisisnottingham.co.uk/ | |
| <DaveMorris> tbh, only graduated in the summer | |
| <VooDoo> DaveMorris: shouldn't be a problem, not looked at that jobs site in ages though | |
| <DaveMorris> although I'll prob stay down here for a few years and get some experience before I look at moving somewhere cheaper where I can afford to live | |
| <VooDoo> DaveMorris: always a good idea, what you looking at getting into? | |
| <DaveMorris> developing, working at Brighton uni atm reverse engineering this eyetracker | |
| <VooDoo> DaveMorris: your a smart arse then ;) right nottingham doesn't want you :) | |
| <DaveMorris> lol | |
| <DaveMorris> http://cgi.ebay.com/Playstation-3-PS3-60-GB-Console-Free-2yr-WARRANTY_W0QQitemZ280051645657QQihZ018QQcategoryZ62054QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#DESCDATA | |
| <DaveMorris> what a twat | |
| <VooDoo> hmm looks dodgy | |
| <VooDoo> i'll buy em :) | |
| <DaveMorris> he set the buy it now price at 99 cents | |
| <VooDoo> i noticed, there probably hot then ;) | |
| <VooDoo> :) | |
| <VooDoo> wonder if anyone will buy them? | |
| <brush01uk> Hi Jono, hope all well & dog is well too,just a quick msg to say just returned from "ARGOS" where I got a ps2 Optical Mouse £5.45,very light light to use works wll brill on Ubuntu E 6.10 & ok if you are on a low budget | |
| <jono> brush01uk, cool :)_ | |
| <brush01uk> Anyway catch up with you soon,keep up the good work | |
| <VooDoo> now if only we could get the eyetoy to wrk too :) | |
| <brush01uk> sorry,as new here, sorry no info on eyetoy | |
| <popey> don't worry brush01uk that's part of a conversation we were having before you arrived | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <brush01uk> ok,A hope all well, ,the problems here is seting up slave drive, hope you may make a screencast on installing some day for newbies | |
| <VooDoo> setting up a slave drive? as in making one master and one slave? | |
| <brush01uk> yes hdb ? | |
| <VooDoo> well you need to make sure the hdd are set to master and slave with jumpers if there in the same ide channel | |
| <VooDoo> on the same ide channel i meant. | |
| <brush01uk> yes ,done, I can mount it, unable to write to it, says it belongs to root, & unable to change permissions | |
| <DaveMorris> where are you mounting it? | |
| <brush01uk> hi Dave, as new, I don't know how to reply to your ? | |
| <brush01uk> sorry im thick | |
| <DaveMorris> ok, when you say you mount it, where abouts is it appearing | |
| <DaveMorris> dosen't mean your thick | |
| <DaveMorris> just means we are crap at asking questions | |
| <brush01uk> back in a mo,will check | |
| <brush01uk> hi Andy | |
| <andy101> hi | |
| <popey> yes brush01uk I should do a screencast about mounting new disks | |
| <popey> that's a good idea | |
| <Seeker`> popey: More Karma? | |
| <popey> i get no karma for them | |
| <popey> not that's measured by launchpad anyway :) | |
| <brush01uk> Dave, in file system in mnt founder | |
| <brush01uk> sorry folder | |
| <grifferz> you need to mount it and then set the ownership of the mount point with chown | |
| <brush01uk> Andy, are you A Brain ? | |
| <andy101> nope | |
| <grifferz> or maybe there is some fancy graphical way of doing that | |
| <DaveMorris> sudo chown -R userid:userid pathtodrive | |
| <DaveMorris> not sure if there is a gui for it or not | |
| <brush01uk> ok, Thankyou Dave I shall have ago & read some more doc's | |
| <DaveMorris> so pathto drive is prob /mnt/hdb | |
| <popey> er | |
| <popey> /dev/hdb1 | |
| <DaveMorris> and userid is what every userid you have | |
| <brush01uk> ok Andy, we are in Redditch | |
| <DaveMorris> popey, thats not where its mounted, but can you do chown on that handle | |
| <DaveMorris> ? | |
| <popey> sorry, ignore me | |
| <brush01uk> Everyone its interesting, ,it was easy in windows,but since i have install Ubuntu & I got rid of every thing to do windows,only linux now :-) | |
| <grifferz> it's also easy in linux, it's just different | |
| <brush01uk> true Grifferz , I won't give in or give up | |
| <andy101> anyone know of a good idiots introduction to what free and open source software is? I am trying to write to my MP but don't know where to start? | |
| <DaveMorris> this to do with the early day montion about free software in education? | |
| <DaveMorris> whats the wikipedia article like | |
| <andy101> the wikipedia articles ok, but alot of its the history of free software and I don't thnk that's particularly relevent to my MP. | |
| <grifferz> andy101: are you looking for the difference between them or just what they are? | |
| <jono> brush01uk, :) | |
| <andy101> Just what they are | |
| <brush01uk> yes Jono, Im reading | |
| <jono> brush01uk, just smley for saying keep up the good work | |
| <jono> thanks | |
| <grifferz> http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html | |
| <jono> I was just reading up | |
| <grifferz> http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php | |
| <brush01uk> Jono, you don't like :-) ? | |
| <jono> eh? | |
| <brush01uk> you don't like smleys ? | |
| <brush01uk> some thing I was reading the other day | |
| <andy101> i thought is was just ;) | |
| <AdamBagnall> brush01uk, it's winkey smileys. jono says they're the spawn of Satan or something ;-) | |
| <jono> I don't like *overuse* of ;) smileys | |
| <brush01uk> O I messed up | |
| <jono> they piss me off :P | |
| <brush01uk> I se, sorry to many drugs here, that's my excuse 33 aday | |
| <Seeker`> woo, hometime | |
| <jono> hometime? | |
| <jono> slacker :P | |
| <Seeker`> i've been here for over 8 hours | |
| <DaveMorris> home time for me soon | |
| <DaveMorris> have to get the train since the cars in the garage (grumble grumble) | |
| <Seeker`> DaveMorris: have to travel far? | |
| <DaveMorris> 9 miles by car, but 50 mins by train! | |
| <DaveMorris> since I have to change | |
| <Seeker`> ah | |
| <Seeker`> where do you have to go to? | |
| <DaveMorris> Brighton to Burgess Hill | |
| <DaveMorris> train is in 20 mins | |
| <Seeker`> right, time for me to run | |
| <Seeker`> seeya | |
| <brush01uk> I wish I could go to work, fed up at home | |
| <DaveMorris> l8rs | |
| <DaveMorris> brush01uk, do some voluter work from home on some OSS project then | |
| <neuro_> <jono> they piss me off :P | |
| <neuro_> <jono> slacker :P | |
| <neuro_> oi | |
| <neuro_> stop overusing :P | |
| <neuro_> :) | |
| <jono> good point | |
| <jono> motherfucker | |
| <jono> :P | |
| <brush01uk> OK, IT WOULD BE SLOW MY SPELLING HAS GONE DOWN, i AM TRYING TO KEEP MY BRAIN GOING, BY TEACHING SOME o a p's Linux with old machines at the mo | |
| <brush01uk> sorry keeps sicking | |
| <brush01uk> keys | |
| <neuro_> jono: /me bows | |
| <neuro_> :) | |
| <brush01uk> All machines are early socket A boxes with small hard drives | |
| <jono> :) | |
| <brush01uk> need to find some free 10 or 20 gig for free? | |
| <brush01uk> amd duron 800 & mine amd 400 k 6 2 400cpu | |
| <brush01uk> anyway it works well | |
| <brush01uk> Catch you all later, my dogs need feeding, Thankyou for your help & time ,Barry | |
| <Seeker`> lo | |
| <chaddy> lo Seeker` | |
| <popey> evening all | |
| <Seeker`> hi | |
| <tsmithe> Read this, if you haven't already | |
| <tsmithe> it's just saying what i already knew | |
| <tsmithe> oh yeah... | |
| <tsmithe> the link | |
| <tsmithe> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/arts/main.jhtml?xml=/arts/2006/11/23/ftsurv23.xml | |
| <JonRob> hi guys | |
| <Narrf> Hi JonRob | |
| <JonRob> wondered if anyone here had a chance to listen to the podcast i put up earlier? | |
| <Narrf> the Questions Please one? | |
| <JonRob> i'm rather nervous about it and craving feed back | |
| <JonRob> ! | |
| <JonRob> ? | |
| <JonRob> oops | |
| * Narrf wonders if i was something he said? | |
| <popey> in a fit of madness.. | |
| * popey installs kubuntu | |
| <popey> .. in a vm :) | |
| * tsmithe was going to do freebsd | |
| <tsmithe> but couldn't be bothered | |
| <tsmithe> linux and freebsd both run gnome | |
| <X3N_> http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/trident/ | |
| <X3N_> it's against the replacment of trident | |
| <tsmithe> we need nukes | |
| <tsmithe> else we'll get nukes | |
| <tsmithe> *nuked | |
| <popey> hahaha | |
| <anti-net_> I think we should replce Trident, with somthing like a boucy casltle....you know for the big kid in tony blair | |
| <anti-net_> Keep him quiet for a while, stop him messing up our country | |
| <anti-net_> oh and Evening all :-) | |
| <tsmithe> guten abend | |
| <anti-net_> hi tsmithe | |
| <X3N_> tony blairs forigen policy is a bit like when you lose you keys; you tear up the place looking for your "keys" but then you find that they were right under your nose all this time! | |
| <anti-net_> its this monitoring people at home that freaks me out and makes me want to burn my passport | |
| <anti-net_> like there finger printing kids in schools without permission now | |
| <tsmithe> did you read the telegraph item | |
| <tsmithe> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/arts/main.jhtml?xml=/arts/2006/11/23/ftsurv23.xml | |
| * popey updates his amazon wish list | |
| <JonRob> hi | |
| <Narrf> Hi again JonRob | |
| <JonRob> sorry for disappearing earlier | |
| <JonRob> my comp hasn't been the same since i took it for repair! | |
| <Narrf> np, i didn't take offence! lol | |
| <JonRob> *phew* | |
| <JonRob> so did anyone reply to my comment about my podcast? | |
| <Narrf> i've got it downloaded on my works laptop to help keep me sane tomorrow in the office | |
| <JonRob> ah brilliant | |
| <JonRob> i hope you enjoy it! | |
| <JonRob> i'm nervous for feedback as it's my first time doing anything like this | |
| <Narrf> I'm sure I will - I'll give you feedback if you want when I've listened | |
| <JonRob> that'd be ace | |
| <Narrf> np | |
| <Narrf> Have you got much feedback yet from anybody? | |
| <JonRob> one guy e-mailed me saying he thought it was really good - works with fsf europe | |
| <JonRob> that's about it thus far! | |
| <JonRob> i'm struggling to get the word out about it | |
| <JonRob> posted to digg but not much coming of it there | |
| <JonRob> and slashdot haven't posted my submission either! | |
| <Narrf> I guess getting the work out is a viral thing | |
| <Narrf> just keep plugging away | |
| <JonRob> yeah...i've sent to linuxformat again too | |
| <JonRob> and all sorts | |
| <JonRob> fingers crossed tho | |
| <JonRob> 'cos in my opinion is definately worth a listen! | |
| <Narrf> :D fair enough | |
| <Narrf> did you get the rss feed sorted? | |
| <JonRob> yeah i think so | |
| <JonRob> it was a typo - altho the problem is i'm only on a digest so any reports on the list of problems take a while to reach me! | |
| <Narrf> ok let me stick in my reader two tics | |
| <JonRob> ah thankyou | |
| <Narrf> seems good here - got the enclosure as well | |
| <JonRob> oh fantastic! | |
| <JonRob> hopefully i didn't alienate too many people with the mistake | |
| <Narrf> I'd personally like to see a little orange rss logo/link on the page tho | |
| <Narrf> even tho i use firefox I like to be able to quickly copy the link url | |
| <JonRob> yeah it's a good point | |
| <JonRob> i'll add one quickly now | |
| <Narrf> especially if I find something when I'm at work - I can then mail me the link | |
| <Narrf> doubt you alienated anyone - maybe lost a few initial reader | |
| <Narrf> but think anyone who looked early will look again anyhow to be honest | |
| <JonRob> is nice to hear | |
| <JonRob> the orange logo should be there now | |
| <JonRob> hopefully | |
| <JonRob> it all looks a bit messy at the minute tho | |
| <Narrf> Yep it's there - I'm happy now | |
| <Narrf> have you many guests lined up already? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Evening all. | |
| <Narrf> evening LoudMouthMan | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Hey Narrf . | |
| <LoudMouthMan> So . does any one have any last hour bids on that TShirt then ? | |
| <JonRob> evening | |
| <JonRob> 'fraid not | |
| <JonRob> altho what's it up to now? | |
| <Narrf> JonRob, that that might be your biggest challenge - finding guests | |
| <JonRob> yeah i think you're right | |
| <JonRob> it's only a casual thing tho | |
| <JonRob> and i'm hoping to do other episodes on different topics from time to time too | |
| <LoudMouthMan> about #300.00 | |
| <JonRob> woah - that's pretty cool! | |
| <JonRob> what's the money to go to? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Children in need | |
| <popey> hey JonRob | |
| <Narrf> JonRob, be good if you could get someone from Novell on - think there might be some tough questions submitted | |
| <popey> listened to the podcast on the way home | |
| <popey> he did | |
| <popey> Jeremy works for Novell :) | |
| <Narrf> True, very true | |
| <JonRob> lol | |
| <JonRob> he's not allowed to comment | |
| <JonRob> we discussed it before recording | |
| <JonRob> well, he promised novell | |
| <JonRob> what did you think popey? | |
| <Narrf> he's kinda stuck in the middle with what the Samba project said tho | |
| <JonRob> yeah | |
| <popey> i forwarded your mail to Sussex, Hampshire, Wolves and Kent Linux User Groups JonRob | |
| <JonRob> oh brilliant thanks | |
| <JonRob> it's difficult to get the word out about it | |
| <JonRob> i've dugg it | |
| <JonRob> but it's not getting much attention | |
| <popey> i thought it was very good | |
| <popey> thanks for including my question | |
| <JonRob> no problem | |
| <JonRob> was a good one | |
| <popey> which actually sparked quite a discussion :) | |
| <JonRob> sorry i didn't give your name! | |
| <popey> that's okay :) | |
| <JonRob> also, just what do you have to do to get slashdotted! | |
| <JonRob> i've submitted the url with a description | |
| <JonRob> and doesn't seem to be getting anywhere | |
| <JonRob> i would have thought stallman,allison and waugh would have been a good article! | |
| <popey> they're so fickle | |
| <Narrf> well i'd have thought so | |
| <X3N_> my little brother made this: http://static.flickr.com/109/304404549_bae17fffa3.jpg?v=0 | |
| <JonRob> i think i'm going to head off to get some sleep | |
| <JonRob> was up early in the morning today | |
| <JonRob> thanks to everyone on here for their support and kindness! | |
| <JonRob> it's much appreciated! | |
| <X3N_> spread the ubuntu love ;) | |
| <JonRob> good luck with the t-shirt auction | |
| <Narrf> night then JonRob - I'll mail you some feedback tomorrow | |
| <JonRob> cheers, | |
| <LoudMouthMan> ah bye . darn . missed him . | |
| <popey> X3N_: like it | |
| <LoudMouthMan> nice | |
| <Narrf> time for some sleep - night all | |
| <LoudMouthMan> indeed . yet another BNI meeting tomorrow ! | |
| <anti-net_> whats BNI LoudMouthMan ? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> business network international . business men get together have breakfast and share business and leads and advice . thing of it as a LUG for Business men | |
| <LoudMouthMan> but it starts at 6.30am | |
| <anti-net_> Ah I see | |
| <anti-net_> 6:30!? damn thos people must have issues or somthing | |
| <LoudMouthMan> yeah making money because we is all self employed and have to get our clients and customers by selling and marketing ourselves. | |
| <anti-net_> I'd love to be self-employed, yeah you could loose everything, and its quite stressful, but atleast you have full control, well maybe not, but more control! | |
| <LoudMouthMan> least stress ful thing ive done in what will soon be going on 9 years ! | |
| <anti-net_> Buiness must be going well then! | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I get stressed out having to answer to a boss, agent or manager at least I can set the agenda for what I am doing and what I am selling. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> more than I can cope with . have now turned down two new clients in Knightsbridge since they are out of my area. | |
| <anti-net_> how many people do you employee? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> me myself and I | |
| <anti-net_> Hah, nice | |
| <LoudMouthMan> with about 14 core clients and 20 tertiary clients and about 23 Ubuntu servers in the wild at last count | |
| <LoudMouthMan> now thanks to the BNI ive pushed out 8 linux desktops and have one BNI member who is coming to the next Lug meet. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> but yo udont have to be self employed to get these results. | |
| <tsmithe> but *you* do1 | |
| <LoudMouthMan> nah you dont. its counter intuitive i know but this is all marketing and promotion. | |
| <tsmithe> hmm | |
| <LoudMouthMan> and anyone can do marketig and promotions irrespective of what they do for a living. In fact everyone engages it in some level. | |
| <anti-net_> do you just provided support for Ubuntu or do you promote other distros? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Im a wholey made Ubuntu guy I moved from debian about two years ago . | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I was Debian like forever then it was Suse and before that um ... well I was a MS developer. | |
| <anti-net_> you worked for MS? or do you mean you devoloped on MS platform | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I used to specialise in COM and DCOM development for net based thinclients. developed for the platform for SDS. | |
| * popey shudders | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I wrote software for boots opticians, specsavers and a few others. | |
| <anti-net_> oh thats not to bad | |
| <anti-net_> if you had worked for MS I would have worried :P | |
| * anti-net_ writes software for windows everyday | |
| <anti-net_> It hurts, but I got to for college | |
| <LoudMouthMan> MS are not so bad to work for. | |
| <anti-net_> hmm | |
| <LoudMouthMan> yeah I love the way we promote Computer edication. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> its all we must teach them what they will use in business. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> which is wierd because we never insist that students in primary school never learn to use a pen or that students in college learn how to fil out forms. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I Actually had a good conversation with a client about top posting and threaded conversations, since they brought it up. | |
| <anti-net_> You have a good point about education, if only the heads of colleges and schools in the UK taught the same way | |
| <anti-net_> thought* | |
| <LoudMouthMan> They wanted good threaded conversations and didnt realise that thet had to do the work to make it better to read ! at the end of the conversation the guy actually added a requirement to the email style sheets. | |
| <tsmithe> they should teach computers in schools. not just microsoft office | |
| <anti-net_> hmm yeah they do seem to focus too heavily on office | |
| <tsmithe> everyone i know is prejudiced | |
| <popey> but its the app the vast majority of the office working population use | |
| <tsmithe> i dont really know why | |
| <tsmithe> i wasnt | |
| <LoudMouthMan> thet should teach computers like they teach maths, physics , mechanical engineering and woodwork. they should teach concepts and skills. but. sigh . this requires teachers with time and support and sylabusses with thought and care. so lets first untangle the polotics of education and lets do it because it should be done. | |
| <tsmithe> popey, therefore they should teach alternatives | |
| <tsmithe> broaden the mind | |
| <popey> all of the thousands of people who work for the company I work for spend all day in office | |
| <tsmithe> do you? | |
| <popey> i agree, but the fact is it is in use | |
| <popey> do I what? | |
| <tsmithe> spend all day in office | |
| <popey> i use outlook most of the day | |
| <popey> and some other proprietary software | |
| <tsmithe> bah | |
| <LoudMouthMan> then the courses will enable them to be better at using it and able to adapt to new software.. | |
| <tsmithe> you should be running linux! | |
| <tsmithe> LoudMouthMan, absolutely | |
| <popey> i am at a customwer | |
| <popey> i DO run linux in MY company | |
| <LoudMouthMan> teach a man to fish and all that eh | |
| <popey> but my customer does not | |
| <popey> and there is no way I can make them run it | |
| <popey> end of story | |
| <tsmithe> bah | |
| <popey> no, not bah | |
| <popey> fact | |
| <tsmithe> yes bag | |
| <tsmithe> *bah | |
| <anti-net_> It is hard to get people to convert | |
| <tsmithe> i dont understand why | |
| <tsmithe> but it is | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hehe . at least I can convince mine to put it on desktops and give it to secretaries , ahh the bliss of small and medium sized business. | |
| <popey> because you have never worked for one of the top 100 companies on the planet? | |
| <anti-net_> i've been trying myself, I can sit down with them and explain it but they run back to there Eck Pee disc too quickly | |
| <popey> they all use windows on the desktop | |
| <popey> they all have windows servers | |
| <popey> yes, some have some linux servers | |
| <popey> but fact is most employees in those companies have windows desktops | |
| <anti-net_> most have MSDN etc etc | |
| <popey> and guess what, they use windows software | |
| <popey> yes, its annoying | |
| <popey> but it allows me to pay my mortgage | |
| <tsmithe> i hate corporatism | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Yeah , as opposed to us desperate people egh <grin> | |
| <anti-net_> become a hippy :P | |
| <LoudMouthMan> nudge nudge | |
| <popey> hah | |
| * popey refuses to take LoudMouthMans bait | |
| * tsmithe is socialist | |
| <popey> I dont support end users, I look after systems | |
| <popey> right | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hehe well anyway BNI lets me get up and tell a room of business owners that theres an alternative | |
| <popey> sigh | |
| <andy101> popey: Why do they use Windows desktops, is it because their employees don't have the skill set to use a Linux desktop, or do they consider Windows a better technical solution? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> after a few months a few try it and as you say from my previous list posting one of them gets it and thinks this is great stuff. | |
| <popey> my customer is well aware that there are aternatives | |
| <popey> they use proprietary software that DOES NOT work on linux | |
| <LoudMouthMan> no its because people are Emotionally attached to windows | |
| <popey> no | |
| <popey> they also use macs | |
| <popey> but the software is very limited on macs | |
| <tsmithe> macs are apparently sexy | |
| <anti-net_> popey, what kind of company is this? | |
| <popey> the software is even more limited on linux | |
| <LoudMouthMan> a top 100 one apparently | |
| <popey> a big one | |
| <tsmithe> which? | |
| <tsmithe> microsoft? | |
| <popey> hah | |
| <popey> no, not even I would stoop that low | |
| <anti-net_> I was more pointing at what kind of buiness they do.... | |
| <LoudMouthMan> mind you , when I worked with Lloyds and Unilever and Casanove and the like they all have unix/linux installs somewhere in the building. but OSS desktops are just not a consideration because issues not related to technology are a concern. | |
| * andy101 has only really had one proper job (being a student), the PC I used ran Fedora (the software guys all run Linux, HR/personel ran Windows) | |
| <andy101> hmm, worded that baddly, my job wasn't being a student | |
| <anti-net_> shame, good job | |
| <andy101> student for 30 weeks a year (ish) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> The issue we get is when new users come in and they go . oh wheres outlook , i cant possibly be productive without outlook. It usually at thispoint the HR girl asks them why they are lacking in ability to manage their work without one particular application. LIke GTD methodology says if you cant work in more than one medium then you really cant work. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> its nice to get sponsorship from the client, in this case its the knowledge that turning into a MS shop for the servers would set the busines back appx 80k in the first year and 23k every 2 years. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> they managed 9 years ago to not join the MS bandwagon, now because they are not tied in and understand the value of freedom over ""productivity"" they are able to invest in more projects and make more money which is what its really all about. | |
| * tsmithe needs sleep | |
| <LoudMouthMan> me too . | |
| <popey> what irks me | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hmmm ? | |
| * LoudMouthMan thought nothing irked the Popey | |
| <popey> is that there is somehow this thought that you can just go into a $large business and say "you should use linux" and they switch the next day | |
| <LoudMouthMan> go on | |
| <popey> which is what tsmithe is kinda indicating | |
| <popey> that's just his youth showing through | |
| <popey> they don't *get* that business doesn't work like that | |
| <popey> and somehow thinking that business apps == office | |
| <popey> is just daft - there's a plethora of apps that customers use that just don't work or dont work well on linux | |
| <LoudMouthMan> thats not a bad thing , I get that it irks you though, but that Youth and drive 20 years ago was us and before MS ruled the world we aere able to make a difference from our backrooms. | |
| <andy101> its nice to be idealistic when young though, the thought that you can make the world a better place is good. | |
| <popey> yes, I'm trying to put things right, and get them moving forward, but it's not as simple as "you should be using linux" - yeah, well done | |
| <popey> well it annoys me that someone thinks that little of me | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I mean look at my recent post Popey, im getting tired of siting around waiting to be perfect, so I vent ( hence I knew Blogs would be dangerous for me ) , | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I dont think that what they think of you popey | |
| <popey> I wrote previously about how I do the things I hate to finance the things I love | |
| <LoudMouthMan> and I can tell your getting anboyed at him | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hey jono | |
| <jono> hey | |
| <popey> moo | |
| <LoudMouthMan> yeah but popey your parting comment in one post irked me so in a way to me you reflected that sentiment. | |
| <jono> popey: I want to leech you screencast knowledge and use it for bad things | |
| <popey> :) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> as is only appropriate jono . | |
| <popey> jokosher? | |
| <popey> my comment about being desparate? | |
| <jono> popey: it includes that | |
| <popey> heh | |
| <jono> you guys finish your discussion first | |
| <popey> I am off to bed now, ping me tomorrow | |
| <popey> heh | |
| <LoudMouthMan> nah dont go popey . .ive got to get up early to . | |
| <andy101> good night popey | |
| <popey> the only reason I said that LoudMouthMan is because it drains me to support windows | |
| <popey> it makes me feel utterly miserable | |
| <popey> really, truly | |
| <LoudMouthMan> yeah but people reaad your comments more than you realise . | |
| <popey> so when I find people asking me to help them with windows issues I get a horrid feeling in my stomach | |
| <popey> partly because it is just NO fun | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I cant help but sit in sussex lug and hear people quote you. | |
| <popey> partly because I know I can fix most stuff, but I know I wont enjoy it | |
| <popey> and partly because I wish the damn losers would switch to linux :) | |
| <popey> "yeah, but popey said.." | |
| <popey> hahaha | |
| <LoudMouthMan> yeah well i support windows clients. when I read it I felt a little abashed | |
| <popey> I'm sorry you felt that way, it wasn't aimed at others who support windows | |
| <popey> just my own inner turmoil | |
| <popey> as I said, I use windows all day every day at the moment | |
| <LoudMouthMan> seriously your discussed more than you think. .. sigh but even trying to mobilse that fro something forward and positive just degenrated into what I did mean. | |
| <jono> what is going on? | |
| <popey> hell today I had to install MSSQL 2005 | |
| <LoudMouthMan> oh popey is being irked at the yout of today | |
| <popey> and there was one component of it that I liked, so I voiced that and everyone thought I was nuts | |
| <popey> boss near fell off his chair | |
| <popey> "you're saying *nice* things about a microsoft product!?" | |
| <popey> "yeah, credit where it's due, that button really looks nice " | |
| <LoudMouthMan> ah well see. now we are heading into the grounds I keep wanting to address. gaining credibility in the eyes of "other" it support staff. because they have been burnt by zealousy | |
| <popey> i guess I live in my little bubble | |
| <LoudMouthMan> if thats a word | |
| <popey> i try not to be too zealotry | |
| <jono> so what exactly happened? | |
| * jono is nosey | |
| <popey> nothing really | |
| <popey> someone said I should use linux at work | |
| <LoudMouthMan> personally id love for you to get involved with the newbury client . | |
| <popey> when I have no control over the desktop / servers where I am right now | |
| <popey> and their response was (the way I took it) "well you clearly aren't making enough effort" | |
| <popey> when in fact what he actually said was "bah" | |
| <popey> maybe I read too much into it :) | |
| <popey> I love linux - I use it every day, I would love nothing more than to quit my current customer and do py/gtk coding for the next few years | |
| <jono> popey: so someone accused you of not been "true" because you use windows at work? | |
| <popey> or advocacy or sys admin or whatever | |
| <popey> yes | |
| <LoudMouthMan> well like I said popey he is of the age where everythign is possible, and it is good. | |
| <popey> indeed | |
| <LoudMouthMan> no they didnt accuse... | |
| <popey> i have to accept that he is young, although not patronise him so | |
| * LoudMouthMan slaps popey with the ironic statement prawn | |
| <popey> hah | |
| <LoudMouthMan> anyway topic change | |
| <popey> the whole reason I quit my job and went self employed was to get away from windows | |
| <popey> and other proprietary software | |
| <jono> the issue is not what you use at work, the issue is your strength of free software argument | |
| <popey> nice line | |
| <jono> as an example, Aq *always* says "no comprise" in any situation, yet uses windows at work | |
| <jono> I like to pull him up on this quite a bit | |
| <popey> hehe | |
| <LoudMouthMan> then popey come join me in the SME market and lets undermine the trend setters | |
| <jono> if someone has a "no comprimise" view, they should not comprimise *at all* | |
| <popey> that's my target LoudMouthMan | |
| <popey> i agree | |
| <popey> MattJ was about earlier pointing similar things out | |
| <popey> working for gnu he should do :) | |
| <jono> so how "no comprimise" are you popey? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> okay well its a off channel conversation popey but if thats your goal then let me help you do that. its what i did and ive helped others do it and I got them into it and promoting OSS at the same time. | |
| <popey> I am not jono | |
| <jono> thats what I thought | |
| <popey> I accept there are things I can change, and things I cannot | |
| <popey> I also appreciate that things move slowly | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Steven Dobson really impresses me .. hes a died in the wool Debian no compromise guy and yet he manages to make a living developing software in debian for clients. | |
| <popey> and one day we will have a free java (\o/), free flash, free this, free that | |
| <popey> but we don't have it yet | |
| <jono> popey: beard | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I just want free choice. | |
| <popey> so I am having to install flash / java / nvidia driver | |
| <popey> in what way jono ? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I see MS have handed over a few documents to the EU | |
| <jono> much as I would love an entirely free software world, it ain't gonna happen | |
| <popey> no, not entirely | |
| <popey> but the bits that matter | |
| <jono> there will always be proprietary software - I don't care about that - I am keen to make free software *better* | |
| <popey> the bits where there is significant pressure to do so | |
| <popey> agreed | |
| <LoudMouthMan> jono, yeah thats why i want choices.. OSS on windows, COM under Linux that sort of thing. | |
| <popey> totally | |
| <jono> we all focus to much on "world domination" which is a misstated goal | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I miss COM <sniff> | |
| <jono> LoudMouthMan: sick bastard :P | |
| <popey> :) | |
| * popey points and laughs | |
| <jono> hehe | |
| <popey> OMG I actually pointed to the screen then | |
| <jono> so popey, lets talk | |
| <popey> jeez | |
| <popey> be quick | |
| <LoudMouthMan> so jono your okay for 11.00 tommorow. | |
| <jono> ok, lets talk tomorrow | |
| <jono> LoudMouthMan: sure thing | |
| <popey> thanks! | |
| <andy101> I supprised people don't push security more when talking to customers, if code is proprietery you don't know what its doing, do you want another company to potential have complete control over your entire comupter system? | |
| <popey> give me one line of what you want and I will dream a little dream of what you want | |
| <jono> you know what I love about laptops? | |
| <jono> right now I am laid in bed watching the west wing while on IRC... | |
| <popey> laying in bed with them on your lap watching porn? | |
| <popey> ahhh | |
| <popey> SO close | |
| <LoudMouthMan> west wing \o/ | |
| <jono> ...and now I am taking a shit. | |
| <popey> andy101: the counter argument is "we don't care, we pay for the software, they have responsbility for that (the vendor), we'll sue them if they fuck up" | |
| <LoudMouthMan> followed by Studio60, Heros and GilmoreGirls. | |
| <popey> right, I need my sleep | |
| <popey> I think tiredness makes me crabby in here | |
| <popey> I shall apologise to tsmithe tomorrow | |
| <popey> sorry chaps | |
| <popey> nn | |
| <LoudMouthMan> laters popey | |
| <andy101> night popey | |
| <LoudMouthMan> Hey jono ive a couple of LR questions | |
| * popey hands jono the bog roll and sprays mighty air freshner | |
| <jono> later dude | |
| <LoudMouthMan> do you mind ? | |
| <jono> popey: hehe | |
| <jono> LoudMouthMan: shoot | |
| <LoudMouthMan> BANG | |
| <LoudMouthMan> oh sorry .. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> um 1) I cant remember if youve ever gotten Eddie Bleasdale on the show only I dug out a presentation He did that I dragged my boss to back in the late 90s; | |
| <jono> oh dear :P | |
| <jono> I know Eddie | |
| <LoudMouthMan> hehe Who doesnt. | |
| * jono smirks | |
| <LoudMouthMan> second question . whats the big secret plan | |
| <LoudMouthMan> anyway im all lined up for that Ubuntu Open Week . | |
| <jono> big secret plan? | |
| <jono> awesome :) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> darn hoped tirdness and west wing would cause you to slip. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> I see the Shirt has reached 300. we really must get the guy to take a picture of it and him when he gets it. | |
| <jono> cool :) | |
| <jono> no secret plan I am afraid | |
| <jono> maybe if you get me pissed I can invent a plan? :) | |
| <LoudMouthMan> ah well thats good since Dobbo and I have secret plan 2.0 for the show next year. | |
| <jono> for the ubuntu-uk stand? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> im also thinking about how Ubuntu can establish it self as a brand in the same way dominos and screwfix has. by prolific, recurrent and consistent appearance. | |
| <jono> cool | |
| <LoudMouthMan> nah Dobbos not a Ubuntu guy. but I have plans for ubuntu UK stand... | |
| <jono> ahhh | |
| <LoudMouthMan> No , Dobbo and I are planning somethiing useful and relative. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> heheh . | |
| <LoudMouthMan> anyway you feeling better now then ? | |
| <LoudMouthMan> right well its late enough for me .. as i said yet another BNI meeting in the Am. | |
| <LoudMouthMan> laters all and good night |
